Monster Revisions

zarquin said:
Really, any of the Mega-class and higher creatures don't really have meaning from a stat perspective. Because by this point you've got the 6000 str which lets you do effectively infinite damage, and so it just boils down to who hits first. And unless the creatures have any divine powers, things like Transtemporal will make the fight instantly over with thier loss.
Agreed.

There is definitely a cut off point where danger X (such as high strength) matters little if the PCs possess ability Y. Example: Pit Traps. Pointless if the PCs can fly. Granted, they can be dangerous again when combined with other hazards (such as Anti-magic) but generally they probably won't pose a problem. Example: A 1000+HD Troll. Yay, a big tough thing. It may be strong, but can it fly? Does it cast spells? It may be able to punch hard, but any PCs facing that thing are probably potent enough to travel through time and kill it while it's a baby, and asleep. Or cast Summon Monster 666 and summon a Neutronium Golem, which probably kills the troll with an intimidate check. (Which it has a -5 to for having 1 charisma, and a +2000 to for having a challenge rating listed as "*Vegeta Voice*: It's over 9000!")
 

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zarquin

First Post
I would love to know what UK considered the CR of the Akashic Records to be using his system, because then anything with a number higher than that doesn't really make any sense.
 

WarDragon

First Post
Given that he listed the Akashic Records' quintessence (and thus, divine rank) as "Infinite," I'm sure you can make an educated guess as to their CR.
 

zarquin

First Post
WarDragon said:
Given that he listed the Akashic Records' quintessence (and thus, divine rank) as "Infinite," I'm sure you can make an educated guess as to their CR.

Well, yes and no. Yes, in the sense that you could never actually kill the Akashic records in a fight. However, you using the IH rules you could effectively become the Akashic records at a FINITE level, and so what ever CR that level corresponds to, would then be the upper limit for which CR ratings have any meaning.

Since the Akashic records is effectively a being with:
Infinite Ability Scores *6
Infinite Reach
Multi-Planar Reach (IE: threatens any square within the range of it's reach, regardless of planar boundaries.)
Jack of all Trades: (basic feat)
Move to Threatened Area: As a move-action can goto any square it threatens.
Trans-temporal
Does not critically fail on a roll of 1
Total Sepll Mastery: Can cast any spell of each level up to the limit of its primary spell casting ability score bonus once per day, and receives a bonus on caster level checks equal to its primary spell casting ability score bonus.
Total Creation Mastery: As a standard action, the character can create anything they have complete knowledge of.
Total Damage Type Mastery: As a timeless action the character can consider his natural attacks to do any type of damage desires. For example he could chose to do Lawful, Evil, Fire Damage, or Instead do Epic Sonic Damage, or maybe Magic Cold-Iron Piercing Damage. He can change attack types between attacks.

These 15 abilities create something that is for all intents and purposes the Akashic Records. And since there are a finite number of these abilites, and all of them can be acheived at a finite leve through mostly Omnific Divine Abilites. Again, there is a finite minimum level to acheive all of these abilites, and that level is the basis for the maximum CR that has any meaning.
 

Omeganian

Explorer
But will you have the proper coordination and mind for watching and analysing everything, everywhere and everywhen? Strong in the Force, you will be, a Jedi, you will be not.

What about balancing the Overlord's true form in the Gates of Hell?
 

Hey all! :)

I am not familiar with the Slayers Guide Land Giant...how many Hit Dice does it have?

Personally I would give humans 3 Hit Dice, so a Mountain sized Giant might be a Macrobe-human with 3072 Hit Dice.

Unfortunately that means +1024 ability score bonuses which lets you have over 1000 Strength which will break the monster - balancewise.

What I would suggest is that you can naturally only increase a score by 50% beyond the average.

So a human average is 10.5 meaning you could naturally enlarge the score by +5

Elf dexterity is 12.5 meaning you could enlarge it by +6, etc.

Of course the starting range is -10 +3d6.

A macrobe human would have an average of 110 strength, with a base range of 103-118, which is about 15d10 base damage from a slam or 40d10 from a 2-h weapon, potentially double damage if your target is smaller than you and on the ground.

So a feasible 80d10+75 (515)

But you could naturally increase that by about +55. Which would be three times more base damage.

The giant itself would maybe have 100,000 hp or thereabouts.
 

dante58701

Banned
Banned
I tend to try to distribute ability bonuses evenly, so as to prevent unbalance. Though for macrobe creatures I tend to put a lot of it into constitution. Big creatures should be able to take a beating, even from one of their own kind.
 

Yes, I agree. While the thing earns 1000+ ability ups, that doesn't mean it has 1110 strength.
Before I assign intelligent foes stat ups, I create a "stat ratio" for how much that monster would value his or her stats.
Example: A Giant - Strength 3, Dex 1, Con 2, Int 1. Wis 1, Cha 2. This means, out of 10 availible stat ups, I throw the first 3 into strength, then the next 1 into dex, etc. (though order doesn't usually matter until you get to less than 10)
This does 2 things: 1 - It prevents the monster from being exploited. (Figuring out what a 1-trick pony does can lead to it's easy defeat. High strength? Enjoy your Dexterity damage.) and 2 - It builds a well rounded foe who potentially qualifies for a broad range of feats. (Feats like Awesome Blow, and a lot of the crazy feats from Savage Species could apply. Thunderclap, Stamp, Fling Enemy and Pain Mastery all make for interesting monster powers for a giant) And this puts it as solidly in one Challenge rating range as possible.
 

dante58701

Banned
Banned
I am so random.

Hunefer

Hunefers are the mummies of deceased immortals of at least demi-deity status.

Hunefers are withered and desiccated. Their features are hidden beneath ages-old funerary wrappings. They move with unbelievable celerity, quickly and efficiently defending their resting places. Most hunefers are inscribed with the symbols and pictured idols that were once important to the immortal mummy.

A Hunefer speaks all spoken languages, though it takes one 1d4 rounds to switch between languages.

Creating a Hunefer

“Hunefer” is an acquired template that can be added to any deceased immortal, of at least demi-deity status, (referred to hereafter as the base creature). This template typically replaces the divine template of the immortal, although a rare few hunefers reacquire or, even rarer, retain their divine status.

A hunefer has all the base creature’s statistics and special abilities except as noted here.

Size and Type: Size is unchanged. The creature’s type changes to undead. Do not recalculate base attack bonus, saves, or skill points.

Hit Dice: Increase all current and future Hit Dice to d20's. A Hunefer has maximum hit points per hit die.

Armor Class:

- Insight Armor Bonus (Ex): A hunefer has an insight armor bonus equal to it's Wisdom modifier.

- Natural Armor Bonus (Ex): A hunefer has a natural armor bonus equal to 1/2 it's Hit Dice or the base creature’s natural armor bonus, whichever is better.

Speed: A hunefer's speed is tripled for all movement types.

Attack: A hunefer has a slam attack according to it's size. If the base creature can use weapons, the hunefer retains this ability. A creature with natural weapons retains those natural weapons, in addition to, or instead of a slam attack, depending on the creature's original form. A hunefer fighting without weapons uses either its slam attack or its primary natural weapon (if it has any). A hunefer armed with a weapon uses its slam attack or a weapon, as it desires. A hunefer's natural attacks are considered epic and evil-aligned for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.

Full Attack: A hunefer fighting without weapons uses either its slam attack (see above) or its natural weapons (if it has any). If armed with a weapon, it usually uses the weapon as its primary attack along with a slam attack as a natural secondary attack, provided it has a way to make that attack (either a free hand or a natural weapon that it can use as a secondary attack).

Damage: A hunefer without natural weapons has a slam attack that inflicts damage according to it's size plus hunefer rot; A hunefer with natural weapons can use its slam attack or its natural weaponry, as it prefers. If it chooses the latter, it deals hunefer on each natural weapon attack.

Special Attacks: A hunefer retains all the base creature’s special attacks and gains those described below. Save DCs are equal to 10 + 1/2 hunefer’s Hit Dice + hunefer’s Charisma modifier, unless otherwise noted.

- Despair (Su): The mere sight of a hunefer requires viewers to succeed at a Will saving throw or be paralyzed with fear for 1d4 rounds. Regardless of the outcome of the save, a subject is not again vulnerable to that hunefer’s despair ability for 24 hours. The save DC is Charisma-based.

- Hunefer Rot (Su): Supernatural disease – slam or natural attack, incubation period instantaneous; damage 1dx temporary Constitution and 1dx temporary Charisma (by hit dice, see below). Unlike normal diseases, hunefer rot requires a victim to make a successful saving throw every round or take another 1dx points of temporary Constitution damage and 1dx temporary Charisma damage (by hit dice,see below). The rot continues until the victim reaches Constitution 0 (and dies) or receives a remove disease spell or similar magic. An afflicted creature that dies shrivels away into sand unless both remove disease and raise dead (or better) are cast on the remains within 2 rounds. If the remains are not so treated, on the third round the dust swirls and forms a mummy, with half as many hit dice as the hunefer, with the dead foe’s equipment, under the hunefer’s command.

Hunefer Hit Dice Constitution Damage Charisma Damage
25 Hit Dice + d4 d4
35 Hit Dice + d6 d6
45 Hit Dice + d8 d8
55 Hit Dice + d10 d10
65 Hit Dice + d12 d12
105 Hit Dice + d20 d20

Spell-Like Abilities: At will - chain lightning, displacement, haste, knock, greater dispel magic, passwall, scrying, greater teleport, true seeing, unholy aura, weird; 1/day - ruin (epic spell). Caster level equal to the hunefer's Hit Dice; save DC 10 + hunefer's Charisma modifier + spell level. The DC is Charisma-based.

Special Qualities: A hunefer retains all the base creature’s special qualities and gains those described below.

- Blindsight (Ex): A hunefer possesses blindsight out to 300 ft..

- Damage Reduction (Ex): A hunefer’s undead body is tough, giving the creature damage reduction equal to one-half it's Hit Dice/ - .

- Fast Healing (Ex): A hunefer possesses Fast Healing equal to one-half it's Hit Dice. This allows the hunefer to rejuvenate lost body parts and limbs. It also allows the hunefer to recover from complete destruction, provided it's canopic jars are still intact. If the hunefer's canopic jars are not intact, the hunefer loses it's Fast Healing ability until they are somehow restored, typically requiring a miracle or a wish for each of it's four canopic jars.

- Fire Vulnerability (Ex): A hunefer is especially vulnerable to fire, taking one-half again (+50 percent) as much damage from fire.

- Spell Resistance (Su): A hunefer possesses spell resistance equal to 10 + it's Hit Dice.

- Undead Traits (Ex): Immune to poison, sleep, paralysis, stunning, disease, death effects, necromantic effects, mind-affecting effects, and any effect requiring a Fortitude save unless it also works on objects. Not subject to critical hits, nonlethal damage, ability damage, ability drain, or energy drain. Negative energy heals. Not at risk of death from massive damage, but destroyed at 0 hit points or less. Darkvision 60 ft. Cannot be raised; resurrection works only if creature is willing.

Abilities: Increase from the base creature as follows: Strength +36, Dexterity +24, Intelligence +8, Wisdom +28, Charisma +26. Being undead, a hunefer has no Constitution score.

Skills: Same as the base creature.

- Maven: A hunefer has maximum ranks all skills it knows.

Organization: Solitary, pair, or court (5-9).

Challenge Rating: Same as the base creature +25.

Treasure: Standard coins; double goods; double items.

Alignment: Any evil.

Advancement: Same as the base creature.

Level Adjustment: Same as the base creature +37.
 
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Hi Ltheb mate! :)

Ltheb Silverfrond said:
Yes, I agree. While the thing earns 1000+ ability ups, that doesn't mean it has 1110 strength.
Before I assign intelligent foes stat ups, I create a "stat ratio" for how much that monster would value his or her stats.
Example: A Giant - Strength 3, Dex 1, Con 2, Int 1. Wis 1, Cha 2. This means, out of 10 availible stat ups, I throw the first 3 into strength, then the next 1 into dex, etc. (though order doesn't usually matter until you get to less than 10)
This does 2 things: 1 - It prevents the monster from being exploited. (Figuring out what a 1-trick pony does can lead to it's easy defeat. High strength? Enjoy your Dexterity damage.) and 2 - It builds a well rounded foe who potentially qualifies for a broad range of feats. (Feats like Awesome Blow, and a lot of the crazy feats from Savage Species could apply. Thunderclap, Stamp, Fling Enemy and Pain Mastery all make for interesting monster powers for a giant) And this puts it as solidly in one Challenge rating range as possible.

I'm even thinking that base hit dice won't give you any bonus ability scores. That really you should only gain these when you advance beyond your original parameters.

Of course this makes setting the CR a bit tricky. But I like a challenge, so I have decided to add the Devastation Humanoid to Gods & Monsters - there are numerous giants from mythology (including the Japanese version Pssthpok gave me the link to not so long ago) who fit the bill. ;)
 

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