Drammattex
First Post
Totally hear you, Aegeri. I know how you feel.
I wish I could give you XP too, but alas I need to spread it around first.
I wish I could give you XP too, but alas I need to spread it around first.
-
The VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX is coming! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Monster Vault: Mages of Saruun
- Thread starter Aegeri
- Start date
Yes and no. Every print product since the original ten Essentials products is essentially 'Essentialized'.
Just a general observation --
I do COMPLETELY agree that more late paragon and epic tier monsters are needed. However, I do not agree that they should be used in this book. This book (according to both title and product description) is specifically for the Nentir Vale, and that is considered a generic starting area for heroes.
Thus, being tied to this region does mean it will revisit some groups that have been discussed in previous adventures (since it's the same region/area), and it also means that tossing in epic tier monsters is not appropriate for the focus of this product (since the area is more so a starting area where having a roaming epic tier monster would just kill any would-be heroic tier adventurers just starting out).
But if this were another Monster Vault that wasn't specific to Nentir Vale, yeah, I really do think it should get more spread in its monster levels.
So it may be important to remember that this isn't just a new Monster Manual/Monster Vault book (aka generic), but rather this is specifically noted as being focused on Nentir Vale and that does bring certain limitations on what is and is not appropriate.
As an aside, I just noticed that Amazon pushed the release of this down 1 week (previously 6/21 now says 6/28) -- not a huge deal, just an observation. Don't know if it's specific to just them or a more general thing.
I do COMPLETELY agree that more late paragon and epic tier monsters are needed. However, I do not agree that they should be used in this book. This book (according to both title and product description) is specifically for the Nentir Vale, and that is considered a generic starting area for heroes.
Thus, being tied to this region does mean it will revisit some groups that have been discussed in previous adventures (since it's the same region/area), and it also means that tossing in epic tier monsters is not appropriate for the focus of this product (since the area is more so a starting area where having a roaming epic tier monster would just kill any would-be heroic tier adventurers just starting out).
But if this were another Monster Vault that wasn't specific to Nentir Vale, yeah, I really do think it should get more spread in its monster levels.
So it may be important to remember that this isn't just a new Monster Manual/Monster Vault book (aka generic), but rather this is specifically noted as being focused on Nentir Vale and that does bring certain limitations on what is and is not appropriate.
As an aside, I just noticed that Amazon pushed the release of this down 1 week (previously 6/21 now says 6/28) -- not a huge deal, just an observation. Don't know if it's specific to just them or a more general thing.
I see this pair being an interesting combo. I might have added some joint powers, letting the mage repair the construct in combat. And I always feel like mages need a "Let Go of Me" power to force PCs away or let them escape being surrounded. Maybe give the construct the power to move an ally anywhere within reach.
(Let Go of Me was an Epic 3e spell, but I think it just did damage?)
(Let Go of Me was an Epic 3e spell, but I think it just did damage?)
Drammattex
First Post
FBA--That's pretty much the long and the short of it.
(I'd have made that an XP comment, but I can't give you more XP yet either!).
Something else in the picture might just grant your wish when the full stats appear...
(I'd have made that an XP comment, but I can't give you more XP yet either!).
Something else in the picture might just grant your wish when the full stats appear...
Last edited:
This logic fails for the simple reason that this is a replacement for Monster Manuals. Especially because the generic Monster Vault did not include hardly any epic tier monsters (13 in fact). So I am not sympathetic to Wizards deliberately cutting their own nose off to spite themselves, by restricting their own products from providing ample support where it is needed.
I've already seen a lot of really great things in this book and a few other things that really feel like "This could have been cut for an epic monster easily". Hopefully the next MV will actually give support across all three tiers of play. Hopefully.
Well, I disagree as I do not believe that this Monster Vault book is meant to replace a generic Monster Manual; it's title and description specifically state it to just be for the Nentir Vale, and that in itself means a focus on the types and levels of monsters it can present.
It's one thing to say you want a MV with epic level support (and I agree with that point as something I want too). But it's another thing to say that this MV title should have included it as that isn't in this product's focus/purpose.
In any case, it's a difference of interpretation/opinion so I can agree to disagree since only WotC really knows the reason for defining a focus for the title.
Edit: clarified something
Last edited:
I entirely disagree with your logic. Monster Vaults ARE replacements for Monster Manuals (this is indisputable to me) and SHOULD support all three tiers. I have no problem with something like Gloomwrought that doesn't have an epic focus providing monsters only in the paragon tier - that is inherently logical. That Wizards chose to paint themselves into a corner and then defend themselves with "Well, we surrounded ourselves with paint" is not a defense. Also the fact is the previous "generic" monster vault also immensely poorly supported epic tier. This is something that should have been rectified in the NEXT product.
Similar Threads
