My player wants an enchanter

[Vyvyan Basterd]

Try to get him to understand that "damage" and "hit points" have drastically changed definition in 4E. An illusion can do damage because it breaks an enemy's resolve just as much as a swing of a sword can wear the enemy down.

It also helps if a tighter definition of what the player wants to achieve can be reached. 4E has tightened roles alot, so just saying "enchanter" doesn't help. What aspects and abilities of being an enchanter in previous editions did the player like. Focus in on the most important ones and find correlating powers in 4E. You may find that the player's definition of "enchanter" may not equal "Wizard" in 4E. Alot of the names are familiar, but the definitions have changed and anyone wanting to play 4E has to change their expectations accordingly.

 

[BigCat]

I'd be happy to make new enchantment powers, but I'm not sure how - even charm person would be so different from existing powers that I wouldn't know how to write it or balance it. Any suggestions?

If he wants an enchanter-type theme, check out Squirreloid's Master of Puppets build (don't have the link handy) or try a star pact warlock. Either of these provides some focus on psychic and fear effects. They also eventually provide more of the "take control of the monster" type effects.

-Chmiwasm

I can't seem to find this anywhere. What forum was it in?

 

[LostSoul]

I'd be happy to make new enchantment powers, but I'm not sure how - even charm person would be so different from existing powers that I wouldn't know how to write it or balance it. Any suggestions?

Charm Person Wizard Attack 1
Encounter ◊ Arcane, Charm, Implement
Standard Action Ranged 10
Target: One creature
Attack: Intelligence vs. Will
Hit: The target makes a basic melee attack against an adjacent creature of your choice. edit: And adds your Intelligence modifier to its attack and damage.

 

[Merlin the Tuna]

Charm Person Wizard Attack 1
Encounter ◊ Arcane, Charm, Implement
Standard Action Ranged 10
Target: One creature
Attack: Intelligence vs. Will
Hit: The target makes a basic melee attack against an adjacent creature of your choice.

Seems a touch weak, though it does scale with your enemies. The issue is that you need to both hit the Wizard's attack roll on the charmed target, then have the charmed target hit his attack roll on his target. I'd add in the Wizard's Int mod in there somewhere. Or maybe Dex, since I picture Charm as being a Wand-y sort of spell. Maybe add Dex to the monster's attack and Int to its damage?

 

[Puggins]

The death of the control wizard is greatly exaggerated. There are many, many control spells that only deal damage as a secondary effect, or occasionally don't deal damage at all. See Thunderwave, Legion's Hold, Evard's Black Tentacles, the Bigby's spells, confusion and so on.

Your player will not be disappointed with his options for control.

 

[Nifft]

Fey-pact Warlock is quite nice, particularly when combined with some Star Pact powers. Social powers, mobility powers, some illusion, and a lot of "dice" powers.

Cheers, -- N

 

[GoodKingJayIII]

I'm going to be starting a 4e campaign later this summer. One of my players has historically always played wizards because he liked to be able to do things other than just do damage - enchantments, illusions, summoning. So, as you might imagine, he's a bit ticked that virtually all of those sorts of spells are now gone (even illusions do straight damage). Any advice on what I should say? What kind of character might I suggest now?

I think a Fey-pact Warlock with a different coat of paint ought to serve you well. "Reskin" some abilities: Shadow Walk becomes Beguiling Movement, rename Prime Shot to Enchanter's Presence. Maybe take away the Pact Boon and give him the Ritual Caster for free. That kind of thing. Perhaps some Wizard multiclassing feats with a few of those new Dragon article Wizard illusions.

It requires some bending (or outright ignoring) some of the class flavor and hooks, but I don't think you'd have to make any mechanical changes if you aren't so inclined.

 

[apoptosis]

Try to get him to understand that "damage" and "hit points" have drastically changed definition in 4E. An illusion can do damage because it breaks an enemy's resolve just as much as a swing of a sword can wear the enemy down.

While this is pretty good it unfortunately has issues in that this loss of resolve does not show its face in any other form of challenge ( ie noncombat, social challenges for example). This might or might not be an issue for the player.

I like your line of thought and TSOY plays this way.

 

[Obryn]

Sadly, it's true that - so far - there are some concepts which 4e can't quite accommodate. This isn't a dig - I love 4e - but every edition has things it can't cover so well out of the box.

For 4e, most of these involve spellcasting of some sort, since it's been dramatically scaled back from previous editions.

I don't know when we'll see an enchanter, but I look forward to it very much.

So far, I think the fey pact warlock will be the closest to what he wants. Or, he can make a wizard and make extensive use out of the Illusion spells in the new Dragon.

-O

 

[apoptosis]

Sadly, it's true that - so far - there are some concepts which 4e can't quite accommodate. This isn't a dig - I love 4e - but every edition has things it can't cover so well out of the box.

For 4e, most of these involve spellcasting of some sort, since it's been dramatically scaled back from previous editions.

I don't know when we'll see an enchanter, but I look forward to it very much.

So far, I think the fey pact warlock will be the closest to what he wants. Or, he can make a wizard and make extensive use out of the Illusion spells in the new Dragon.

-O

Given its focus, i have doubts that it will ever do a classic enchanter much justice. Enchanter powers require so much adjucation from the DM and have such a wide breadth of utility.

But this just means that the game is not well suited to create certain archetypes which is going to be an issue with most any system.