Mystic Theurge and Spectral Hand

[F5]

I'm pretty sure this works, but if someone knows any specific rulings for or against this tactic, they'd be appreciated.

The Spectral Hand spell allows any touch-range spell of up to 4th level that you cast to be cast at range. It never says it has to be an arcane spell.

A mystic theurge (or any multiclass combo with access to divine spells) with this spell could cast, say, Poison as a ranged touch attack? Or Cure Critical Wounds?

Sounds like a pretty effective use of a 2nd level spell...

Thanks, all.

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

That certainly does work.

Note that a cleric with the Magic Domain could do the same trick with a scroll or wand of Spectral Hand.

 

[Someone]

In fact, it´s almost required if you want to heal with a Mystic Theurge. Going near the front ranks? *shudders*

 

[shilsen]

As Ridley's Cohort and Someone said, it works just fine. With one clarifier:

A mystic theurge (or any multiclass combo with access to divine spells) with this spell could cast, say, Poison as a ranged touch attack? Or Cure Critical Wounds?

It is not a ranged touch attack, but a melee touch attack (which the spell gives you a +2 to). Makes a significant difference for spellcasters who have much higher Dex than Str.

 

[F5]

It is not a ranged touch attack, but a melee touch attack (which the spell gives you a +2 to). Makes a significant difference for spellcasters who have much higher Dex than Str.

You're right, shilsen. There's a big difference between "ranged touch attack" and "melee touch attack usable-at-range".

Thanks for the validation, all. I've got a cohort coming to my wizard character, and I thought a mystic theurge apprentice might be fun (even if it's not the best tactical choice). I'm sure this tactic will see lots of use.

 

[Hypersmurf]

It is not a ranged touch attack, but a melee touch attack (which the spell gives you a +2 to). Makes a significant difference for spellcasters who have much higher Dex than Str.

It also makes a significant difference to Arcane Tricksters.

A ranged attack can only be a sneak attack if you are within 30'.

A melee attack has no such limitation... you can sneak attack with a Spectral Handed Shocking Grasp from 100' away or more.

-Hyp.

 

[Jeff Wilder]

It is not a ranged touch attack, but a melee touch attack (which the spell gives you a +2 to). Makes a significant difference for spellcasters who have much higher Dex than Str.

As an aside, note that because it's a melee attack, any Strength penalty the mystic theurge has counts against the touch attack made with spectral hand. Weird, and you might easily convince a DM to house-rule it, but them's the RAW. (Yes, my necro-theurge has a Strength of 8. Why do you ask?)


Jeff

 

[Li Shenron]

As an aside, note that because it's a melee attack, any Strength penalty the mystic theurge has counts against the touch attack made with spectral hand. Weird, and you might easily convince a DM to house-rule it, but them's the RAW.

There's a small bonus of +2 on the attack to help, but yes it's still a melee touch attack at a distance, not a ranged touch attack so Str is still the relevant ability. (A character focusing on this tactic has a great reason to take Weapon Finesse.)

However it's still very convenient! If it turned the touch spell into a ray, a missed attack would discharge the spell. Being still a melee touch attack, if you miss you still have the spell on the spectral hand! If you add the consideration that touch spells sometimes don't give a saving throw (e.g. Vampiric Touch), this means that beside SR there's nothing which can make the spell wasted.

 

[Darklone]

A melee attack has no such limitation... you can sneak attack with a Spectral Handed Shocking Grasp from 100' away or more.

Well, just don't forget that you can't flank with the hand Sadly.

 

[Li Shenron]

Well, just don't forget that you can't flank with the hand Sadly.

Except that this spell specifically allows it!

edit: ehm... I must have dreamed about it

edit 2: Doh! Wasn't a dream! Phew...

A ghostly, glowing hand shaped from the character's life force materializes and moves as the character desires, allowing the character to deliver low-level, touch range spells at a distance. On casting the spell, the character loses 1d4 hit points that return when the spell ends (even if it is dispelled), but not if the hand is destroyed. (The hit points can be healed as normal.) For as long as the spell lasts, any touch range spell that the character casts of 4th level or lower can be delivered by the spectral hand. The spell gives the character a +2 bonus to the character's melee touch attack roll, and attacking with the hand counts normally as an attack. The hand always strikes from the character's direction. The hand can flank targets like a creature can. If the hand goes beyond the spell range, goes out of the character's sight, or if the character is not directing it, the hand returns to the character and hovers.

The hand is incorporeal and thus cannot be harmed by normal weapons. It has improved evasion (one-half damage on a failed save against an area spell and no damage on a successful save), the character's save bonuses, and an AC of at least 22. The character's Intelligence modifier applies to the hand’s AC as if it were the hand’s Dexterity modifier. The hand has 1 to 4 hit points, the same number that the character lost in creating it.

A ghostly, glowing hand shaped from your life force materializes and moves as you desire, allowing you to deliver low-level, touch range spells at a distance. On casting the spell, you lose 1d4 hit points that return when the spell ends (even if it is dispelled), but not if the hand is destroyed. (The hit points can be healed as normal.) For as long as the spell lasts, any touch range spell of 4th level or lower that you cast can be delivered by the spectral hand. The spell gives you a +2 bonus on your melee touch attack roll, and attacking with the hand counts normally as an attack. The hand always strikes from your direction. The hand cannot flank targets like a creature can. After it delivers a spell, or if the hand goes beyond the spell range, goes out of your sight, the hand returns to you and hovers.

The hand is incorporeal and thus cannot be harmed by normal weapons. It has improved evasion (half damage on a failed Reflex save and no damage on a successful save), your save bonuses, and an AC of at least 22. Your Intelligence modifier applies to the hand’s AC as if it were the hand’s Dexterity modifier. The hand has 1 to 4 hit points, the same number that you lost in creating it.

Things change...