New GSL Announcement

[BryonD]

Yeah, but I don't accept this as a given fact either.

And I'm still praying it is wrong as well. I'll be thrilled to have been misled by bad information.
But it certainly doesn't sound that way. I think there is a better chance of WotC changing their mind than of the current info being wrong.

But, are you saying if it does come out as fact that your position would be at least moved somewhat?

 

[Dinkeldog]

Clark,

Check your email

I could point out that if you and Orcus became Community Supporters, you could PM each other and not taunt us with half-conversations. You know, just saying.

Have to cheerlead for the site once in a while.

 

[Jack99]

I could point out that if you and Orcus became Community Supporters, you could PM each other and not taunt us with half-conversations. You know, just saying.

Have to cheerlead for the site once in a while.

Yeah, because it is not like messages like that one peaks our curiosity... not at all, no Sir..

 

[BSF]

I'm glad for all the info.

I would also like to point out a consumer reaction that WotC may not have thought about, and has only really been touched apon in any of the threads I've read on the topic.

</SNIP>

I don't really have to be empathetic to WotC's plans on this matter...well because I'm a consumer and justification of this act really isn't much of a necessity to me in comparison to having access to the games I want to play.

WotC may want to give some consideration to people like me when they start signing up companies that then have to pull their products that I patronize off of the market.

You are not singular in this regard. I would also hazard a guess that WotC has considered this effect to some degree. In the end, it comes down to an estimate on how much market share people like you and I influence.

The fact is, none of us needs more roleplaying material. It is a luxury market item, competing with other entertainment spending dollars. I could game for years and years without buying one new item. I can afford to make decisions based on arbitrary things like my like/dislike of a company. I am fickle and I have left entire companies because I didn't like their business practice and decisions. I have also supported companies simply because I like the company.

But how much market share do we influence? Is it enough to matter to WotC and their decisions?

I am not going to make a blanket statement that I would stop buying WotC material just because all of the worst aspects of exclusivity come out in the GSL. But the poison pill aspect doesn't taste good and when a company leaves a bad taste in my mouth, I am less likely to patronize them.

 

[La Bete]

And I'm still praying it is wrong as well. I'll be thrilled to have been misled by bad information.
But it certainly doesn't sound that way. I think there is a better chance of WotC changing their mind than of the current info being wrong.

But, are you saying if it does come out as fact that your position would be at least moved somewhat?

I suspect there is a bit of "wrong end of teh stick" as well as potential for further change. Though I very much believe that there will be pressure on 3pps to put aside support for 3e.

To be honest though, if it is that bad, would my position change? No not really. If the 3e/OGL products are that good, they will continue to sell. If they're not, they won't.

Clark indicated (I think) that WotC are ok with the Necro/Paizo 4e/3e split in support. So I don't see any issues with publishers doing some sort of finessing to manage the situation. Ditto in the case of having to stop selling older stock (which I'm not convinced will occur).

 

[Scott_Rouse]

I could point out that if you and Orcus became Community Supporters, you could PM each other and not taunt us with half-conversations. You know, just saying.

Have to cheerlead for the site once in a while.

I am or was. I gave my money via PayPal but my public profile never updated. It says I am in my user profile. I can PM so it must be Orcus.

 

[BSF]

I am or was. I gave my money via PayPal but my public profile never updated. It says I am in my user profile. I can PM so it must be Orcus.

If you are a CS, you should be able to update your profile with all sorts of verbiage. Of course, even with a CS account, you can decide not to accept PMs. Given the position that both you and Clark have within the community, I wouldn't be surprised if one or both of you refused PMs on the basis that you might be inundated with unwanted messages.

 

[BryonD]

I suspect there is a bit of "wrong end of teh stick" as well as potential for further change. Though I very much believe that there will be pressure on 3pps to put aside support for 3e.

To be honest though, if it is that bad, would my position change? No not really. If the 3e/OGL products are that good, they will continue to sell. If they're not, they won't.

I think you are pulling a bait and switch on the point here.
Quality is completely after the fact for this matter.
First, if companies feel compelled to drop OGL products then there won't be anything to judge as good or bad.
Second, depending on how many publishers stay or go, the impact on the market as a whole could strongly impact the ability to survive with even the very highest of quality.
The quality issue is a red herring to the point of the highly negative impacts of a GSL assualt on open gaming.

Clark indicated (I think) that WotC are ok with the Necro/Paizo 4e/3e split in support. So I don't see any issues with publishers doing some sort of finessing to manage the situation. Ditto in the case of having to stop selling older stock (which I'm not convinced will occur).

Paizo and Necromancer are stand outs in the overall 3P OGL field and do not accurately represent the overall community. And even with that, having to deal with this kind of extra hoop-jumping will be a notable disincentive.

 

[Scott_Rouse]

If you are a CS, you should be able to update your profile with all sorts of verbiage. Of course, even with a CS account, you can decide not to accept PMs. Given the position that both you and Clark have within the community, I wouldn't be surprised if one or both of you refused PMs on the basis that you might be inundated with unwanted messages.

Got it. I thought it was automatic but I just learned I have to paste it in.

Thanks

 

[JVisgaitis]

So I just read through the bulk of all this. I would have thought that the announcement of an open 4e would have been met with people singing in the streets. Instead, we get another mired mess which is understandable considering the implications of the license.

Basically, I'm REALLY happy that 4e is open. I was pretty sure that it wouldn't be closed up, but Clark sowed my thoughts with much doubt. At least that worry is off my chest. Am I happy with the price we might have to pay for the sake of 4e being open? Not at all. Companies like Paizo and Green Ronin inspired us (and I'm sure a lot of other companies) to push the envelope and raise the bar. Considering the fact that they may be left by the wayside is very upsetting.

One thing I want to point out is how well Chris and Erik have handled all of this. I don't think a lot of people understand the amount of pressure you guys must be under with all of this and it seems like it just keeps getting worse. You guys are true scholars and gentleman. If I was in your position and my entire livelihood depended on what was going on with all of these delays and everything else, I only hope I could handle it with the elegance and grace that you guys have.

And to Scott and Linae, man, are you guys are taking a beating on this thread. I hope a lot of the snarkiness and nerd rage you guys are the brunt of doesn't keep you from posting here. I feel that you guys are genuinely concerned about the community and open gaming and I just wanted to say thanks for all your hard work and continuing to put up with the community. I know you guys handled everything the best you could, and I don't fault you for that one bit.