NPCs created as PCs

[MarauderX]

I have also done the same. I used 3 NPCs (Fighter & 2 rogues) at 6th level that was to keep a 6th level party of 5 busy keeping each other alive. The original idea was to have all 3 bear down on one PC, trying to drop one at a time. However, the party decided to have only 3 of their number at the encounter (wizard, warlock, cleric). I changed their strategy to be a bit more blundering, switching targets often to spread the damage around, but they ended up doing the same - spreading damage and not controlling them well. The PCs lost, and they were ransomed in the next session.

My advice would be to plan to use one daily and one encounter power for each. That way there is no time for you to hem and haw with deciding what to use. Since they are only going to be around for one encounter you may as well have them unload all they have as fast as they can. That also makes it easier and faster for you, as doing so might put the party on the defensive. They may think the encounter is too tough for them, with suddenly the NPCs all unloading daily/encounter powers, but it makes your job easier as the combat evolves.

 

[DracoSuave]

Just remember that level 1 PCs do not make for level 1 monsters. All other things being equal, a party of equal level NPCs will be a 50/50 chance of a TPW. (in before party build, etc)

'Level 1 monster' doesn't mean the same thing as it did in 3rd edition. But if you understood how it DID work in 3rd, concider it this way: A single level 1 PC was an EL 1. 2 would have been EL 3, and 4 would have been EL 5.

EL 5 encounters would have a reasonable chance of destroying a level 1 party, right?

In 4e, a level 5 encounter would have a reasonable chance of destroying a level 1 party. A party of level 1 PCs would be an approximate level 5 encounter or so.

 

[Nail]

Imagine a guy with a whip:
He uses it to trip at range. ranged: Ranged 3; Standard; At-Will; Dex vs. Ref; Hit: med damage and the target is prone.)
He also can tie you up with it. ranged: Ranged 3; Standard; At-Will; Dex vs. Ref; Hit: low damage and the target is restrained.)
He can drag you around with it. ranged: Ranged 3; Minor; At-Will; Restrained targets only; Dex vs. Ref; Hit: Slide 3.)
And he snatch your weapon out of your hand! ranged: Ranged 3; Standard; Encounter; Dex vs. Ref; Hit: disarmed and the weapon is in the whipmaster's hand.)
And when he's cornered, he lashes out like crazy. close: Close Blast 1; Immediate Reaction; When first bloodied; Dex vs. Ref; Hit: low damage.)

This guy is a Controller.

That's cool! ...But aren't those "too many" powers? I'm not sure: how many powers should an elite (which is what you seem to be creating) have?

 

[Muminalver]

I was wondering how would it work if you Run NPC alongside the pc, like having them being henchmen for the NPC ( Npc acting as general and the PC acting as his Bodyguard during a series of fights).
Or if i can't get a full group how many NPC would be required for filling.
Does it go 2 NPC same lvl as each pc??
How would you do it? Or is it impossible to run D&D 4th like that??

 

[LostSoul]

That's cool! ...But aren't those "too many" powers? I'm not sure: how many powers should an elite (which is what you seem to be creating) have?

I'm not sure, I was just going with the flow. I seem to recall the DMG saying an Elite needs to be able to make 2 attacks and (have a way to react to the moves of the PCs or gain a bonus when bloodied).

Ah, here's the DMG:

Recharge When First Bloodied: An encounter power recharges.

Immediate Actions: He does something that triggers when the PCs do something.

Additional Attacks: Instead of an Immediate Action, he can make another attack.

 

[Paul Strack]

In my experience, making an NPC with the full PC rules is overkill. Either they won't live long enough to use all their powers and you are wasting effort, or you are giving them too many powers and will overwhelm the PCs.

I recommend using the "Creating NPCs" rules from DMG p. 187-188. You might also take a look at my "Book of NPCs", which has several thousand pre-generated NPCs for various builds, races and levels, which you can use as-is or customize to your heart's content.

Downloads - D&D 4th Edition - Book of NPCs - EN World D&D / RPG News

 

[Mal Malenkirk]

Have any of you ever tried making a group of antiheroes in your campaign? What do you think about it in general?
Is it too complex to have a fight between two groups of "PCs"?

Not too complex if you have a good grasp on the PC classes.

Just be aware, obviously enough, that if you oppose 5 'Anti-PCs' of the same level to your 5 PCs you are of course dealing with at least 50% chances of beating the crap out of them. That's assuming the PCs have all their dailies available, everyone has at least 3 healing surge, an AP and the PCs work together well instead of selfishly. If they don't... TPK.

 

[Starfox]

This is amount of preparation is the kind of thing I changed to 4.0 to get away from. If you like this level of preparation, I think 3.5 might be a superior game for you.