D&D (2024) One D&D Survey Feedback: Weapon Mastery Spectacular; Warlock and Wizard Mixed Reactions

Jeremy Crawford discusses the results of the Packet 5 Survey:

• Weapon Mastery at 80% approval, and all options except for Flex scored similarly. Crawford says that Flex is mathematically one of the most powerful properties, but will need some attention because people didn't feel like it was. This feature is in the 2024 PHB for 6 Classes, guaranteed at this point.
• Barbarian scored well, particularly the individual features, average satisfaction of 80% for each feature. Beserker got 84% satisfaction, while the 2014 Beserker in the 2020 Big Class Survey got 29% satisfaction.
• Fighter received well, overall 75% satisfaction. Champion scored 54% in the Big Class Survey, but this new one got 74%.
• Sorcerer in the Big Class Survey got 60%, this UA Sorcerer got 72%. Lots of enthusiasm for the Metamagic revisions. Careful Spell got 92% satisfaction. Twin Spell was the exception, at 60%. Draconic Sorcerer got 73%, new Dragon Wings feature was not well received but will be fixed back to being on all the time by the return to 2014 Aubclass progression.
• Class specific Spell lists are back in UA 7 coming soon, the unified Spell lists are out.
• Warlock feedback reflected mixed feelings in the player base. Pact magic is coming back in next iteration. Next Warlock will be more like 2014, Mystic Arcanum will be a core feature, but will still see some adjustments based on feedback to allow for more frequent use of Spells. Eldritch Invocations were well received. Crawford felt it was a good test, because they learned what players felt. They found the idiosyncracy of the Warlock is exactly what people like about it, so theybare keeping it distinct. Next version will get even more Eldritch Invocation options.
• Wizard got a mixed reception. Biggest problem people had was wanting a Wizard specific Spell list, not a shared Arcane list that made the Wizard less distinct. Evoker well received.

 

[Charlaquin]

Since the players don't always know what they'll be doing or encountering and the Wizard is the ultimate utility class it stands to reason that anytime the wizard doesn't know what they'll be facing they'll make choices that will simply not be useful. Nothing about the wizard class was built around the assumption that resources are meant to be spent 100 percent every game day.

Of course you aren’t going to use every spell slot every day. A unused slot is still a wasted slot. Both things are true. For the third time, the tension between efficient resource use and safe resource use is the fundamental challenge of resource management gameplay.

does that mean if a rogue doesn't use all thier abilities they were wasted?

Rogue abilities don’t cost resources. Rogue gameplay is about action economy management, not resource management. That said, yes, if a rogue ends their turn without using their bonus action, that’s absolutely a wasted bonus action. (Technically that’s true of all classes, but it’s more important for rogues to use their action economy efficiently than it is for most other classes).

 

[Charlaquin]

In theory only, IME.

Spamming spells like they’ll never run out isn’t using spells based on the needs of the situation. Those are two entirely separate behaviors.

I disagree. The current situation can always benefit from more firepower. The only reason not to use all of your highest level spell slots as quickly as possible is because you might need them later. And if you conserve your resources for that reason, you’re by definition taking more than the current situation into account. As well you should! That’s the challenge of resource management gameplay - balancing efficient use vs prudent conservation to get the most value out of your limited resources over the course of the whole adventuring day, without running yourself out too early.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I disagree. The current situation can always benefit from more firepower. The only reason not to use all of your highest level spell slots as quickly as possible is because you might need them later. And if you conserve your resources for that reason, you’re by definition taking more than the current situation into account. As well you should! That’s the challenge of resource management gameplay - balancing efficient use vs prudent conservation to get the most value out of your limited resources over the course of the whole adventuring day, without running yourself out too early.

It’s possible I’ve lost track of your side of this exchange, but this reads to me like semantics being used to falsely make it appear as though my position is in agreement with a thing it is not.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I disagree. The current situation can always benefit from more firepower. The only reason not to use all of your highest level spell slots as quickly as possible is because you might need them later. And if you conserve your resources for that reason, you’re by definition taking more than the current situation into account. As well you should! That’s the challenge of resource management gameplay - balancing efficient use vs prudent conservation to get the most value out of your limited resources over the course of the whole adventuring day, without running yourself out too early.

I think I’ve figured out one area of disconnect. I experience this part of play as strongly tied to immersion and roleplaying, much moreso than the game part of the game. I’m guessing you see it more in the “players vs the environment” mindset where resources limits exist and are good because they force players to manage resource pools over a day.

Regardless of design intent, my group and I experience spell slots as existing to tell a different story than would be the case with a different limiting factor (and it’s rare to have a good fantasy story without limiting factors on magic).

But the other disconnect is extant even when I am playing in a more skilled play mode, because again I just disagree that it matters at all that I could be using more spell slots. Even if I’m trying to optimize spell slot usage, which I am almost never concerned with, I’m still going to shoot for having some of my daily ability resources left when we end the day.

Here are some reasons why:

• Stuff can happen at night, interrupting a long rest
• “Go until you’re out of gas” simply leaves you less effective at the end of the day, while “leave something for the way back” allows the last encounter of the day to be engaged with while still having significant firepower to throw around
• If we can choose between ambushing the troll right now or after a rest, and we are 10 to even 30%, we’re better off doing it after a rest
• If your DM isn’t predictable and/or doesn’t strongly telegraph what’s coming up next, you will probably miscalculate and waste resources fireballing mooks that could have been cleared in one round using at-will abilities, and have very little to use when it really counts.

 

[Charlaquin]

It’s possible I’ve lost track of your side of this exchange, but this reads to me like semantics being used to falsely make it appear as though my position is in agreement with a thing it is not.

My position is simple: if you run out of spell slots before the end of the day, you should probably consider being a bit more careful with them. If you have spell slots left over at the end of the day, you should probably consider being a bit more free with them. Balancing between those is what the resource management challenge is all about.

 

[tetrasodium]

My position is simple: if you run out of spell slots before the end of the day, you should probably consider being a bit more careful with them. If you have spell slots left over at the end of the day, you should probably consider being a bit more free with them. Balancing between those is what the resource management challenge is all about.

I found that missing rollerskate guys

 

[Charlaquin]

I think I’ve figured out one area of disconnect. I experience this part of play as strongly tied to immersion and roleplaying, much moreso than the game part of the game. I’m guessing you see it more in the “players vs the environment” mindset where resources limits exist and are good because they force players to manage resource pools over a day.

Regardless of design intent, my group and I experience spell slots as existing to tell a different story than would be the case with a different limiting factor (and it’s rare to have a good fantasy story without limiting factors on magic).

Hard for me to say, but that’s probably a pretty accurate assessment.

But the other disconnect is extant even when I am playing in a more skilled play mode, because again I just disagree that it matters at all that I could be using more spell slots. Even if I’m trying to optimize spell slot usage, which I am almost never concerned with, I’m still going to shoot for having some of my daily ability resources left when we end the day.

Here are some reasons why:

• Stuff can happen at night, interrupting a long rest

As I said to someone else, if you know you’re likely to be attacked mid-rest, such as if you’re in an area full of wandering monsters or being pursued by enemies with murderous intent, then that’s going to affect the calculus. In such a situation, it may be wiser to risk letting a few spell slots go to waste than to risk being caught without any spell slots in the middle of the night.

• “Go until you’re out of gas” simply leaves you less effective at the end of the day, while “leave something for the way back” allows the last encounter of the day to be engaged with while still having significant firepower to throw around

If you know it’s the last encounter of the day, why not use that significant firepower? You’ll get those spell slots back anyway, use them while the getting is good! Again, unless you have reason to suspect it won’t actually be the last encounter of the day (such as if being attacked in the night is a likely possibility).

• If we can choose between ambushing the troll right now or after a rest, and we are 10 to even 30%, we’re better off doing it after a rest

Well, sure! If you have that opportunity, it may well be worth letting those last 10-30% of your resources go to waste rather than risk entering that fight at a reduced capacity. That’s a valid strategic sacrifice.

• If your DM isn’t predictable and/or doesn’t strongly telegraph what’s coming up next, you will probably miscalculate and waste resources fireballing mooks that could have been cleared in one round using at-will abilities, and have very little to use when it really counts.

Of course, miscalculating is always a potential risk in a resource management game. But just because perfectly efficient resource planning is likely unattainable doesn’t mean it shouldn’t still be a goal to strive for. “A spell slot unspent is a spell slot wasted” doesn’t mean “don’t ever leave any spell slots unspent.” It just means realize that there is a real cost to leaving spell slots unspent, and take that cost into consideration when deciding when to use your spell slots vs. when to save them.

 

[Charlaquin]

I found that missing rollerskate guys

Is that a reference?

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I found that missing rollerskate guys

I don’t know what you’ve got against Charlequin, but it’s getting old even from the outside observing the interactions.

 

[tetrasodium]

Is that a reference?

more noting a trend