D&D General One thing I hate about the Sorcerer

[Stormonu]

3-4 accurate attacks every 6 seconds with a weapon over 1 pound is superhuman.

I couldn't find how heavy a SCA rattan sword is, but after watching some live tournament fighting this weekend, I would dispute that.

 

[Minigiant]

I couldn't find how heavy a SCA rattan sword is, but after watching some live tournament fighting this weekend, I would dispute that.

Accurate attacks?

Not quick jabs.
Accurate meaningful power attacks at a moving living target?
And able to do in again next turn?
After running 30 feet?

Mundane my butt.

 

[Stormonu]

Accurate attacks?

Not quick jabs.
Accurate meaningful power attacks at a moving living target?
And able to do in again next turn?
After running 30 feet?

Mundane my butt.

Standing next to each other mostly, but ringing like church bells against helmet or shield.

Couldn't find anything on the level I was seeing this last weekend (Sir Magnus vs. Sir James the Pious) where they were really (continuously) going after each other. Of course, they're doing both mock and "one solid blow 'kills'" and the combat ring is probably only about 10 to 15 feet square (and they're usually standing beside one another). Funnily enough, as I was watching I was actually counting out time to get a sense of about how many blows they were getting in during a single six-second stretch.

Just to give an idea of what they're doing (but not the flurries I was seeing):

 

[Minigiant]

Standing next to each other mostly, but ringing like church bells against helmet or shield.

Couldn't find anything on the level I was seeing this last weekend (Sir Magnus vs. Sir James the Pious) where they were really (continuously) going after each other. Of course, they're doing both mock and "one solid blow 'kills'" and the combat ring is probably only about 10 to 15 feet square (and they're usually standing beside one another). Funnily enough, as I was watching I was actually counting out time to get a sense of about how many blows they were getting in during a single six-second stretch.

Just to give an idea of what they're doing (but not the flurries I was seeing):

Again

Not 3-4 accurate meaning attack in 6 seconds.

The attack patterns of Martials above level 10 would be blatantly supernatural and look like something out of the movies/cartoons/anime.

The idea that you can attack and kill 3 warriors while fully defending yourself in 6 seconds outside of performing a prepared routine with the perfect setup is the stuff of myth and legend.

 

[James Gasik]

Again

Not 3-4 accurate meaning attack in 6 seconds.

The attack patterns of Martials above level 10 would be blatantly supernatural and look like something out of the movies/cartoons/anime.

The idea that you can attack and kill 3 warriors while fully defending yourself in 6 seconds outside of performing a prepared routine with the perfect setup is the stuff of myth and legend.

Not even taking into account the truly time-bending power of Action Surge!

 

[FrozenNorth]

Some people seem to think magic in the D&D sense and supernatural mean the same thing.

Pathfinder (and maybe 3.5) has extraordinary (Ex) and supernatural (Su). The distinction wasn’t particularly useful and later editions got rid of it.

I see no compelling reason to bring it back.

 

[FrozenNorth]

I will concede hit points don't make sense forever if people will please come up with any other evidence to support their rhetorical positions.

But it isn’t just hit points, it’s combat in general, as a fighter with a longsword shouldn’t be able to pierce the hide of an ancient dragon, much less kill it.

 

[Minigiant]

Going back to the Sorcerer, it's too bad WOTC didn't try hard with Spell Lists and that Paizo and Kobold Press did the easy route of making spell lists only for their main casters of the Traditional! tropes.

Because another idea I had was having Sublists.

You'd have the main lists of Arcane, Divine, and Primal. Then you'd have Sublists that represent twists, refinements, and corruptions of those magic.

• Arcane
  • Elemental
  • Eldritch
  • Wizardry
• Divine
  • Upper
  • Lower
• Primal
  • Glamour (For Feywild)
  • Shadow (For Shadowfell)

The Wizard would have access to all Arcane and Wizardry spells.
The Sorcerer would have access to all Arcane spells. Then some might one sublist based on subclass.
The Warlock would have access all Arcane and Eldritch spells.
The Bard would get 1 main list and 1 sublist. Traditional bard is Arcane + Upper.

Later if you make the Psion and make the Psionic sublist under Arcane.
The Abberant Mind Sorcerer now gets the Psionic sublist. And now Bards can pick.Psionic.
Someone makes Shaman for Primal + Upper/Lower.

 

[CreamCloud0]

But it isn’t just hit points, it’s combat in general, as a fighter with a longsword shouldn’t be able to pierce the hide of an ancient dragon, much less kill it.

can i take it your point here is 'but the rules mean they can, so obviously we're not dealing with just a regular earth guy here, but someone stronger'?

 

[Micah Sweet]

3-4 accurate attacks every 6 seconds with a weapon over 1 pound is superhuman.

So basically, the numbers in the game being abstracted beyond reality is excuse enough to abandon all ideas of logic and assume everyone is "magic" even if the game we're actually playing never tells us that?