Pathfinder 1E Paizo Announces More Details about Minis Line

[Dannager]

Whenever the WotC vs. Paizo debate comes up people seem to take for granted that WotC tarnished its goodwill while Paizo continues to dedicate resources to develop and maintain theirs. Yet, in the next breath, they wonder why reactions to the two companies differ. As someone not in either camp, that has always confused me.

Because, regardless of how much goodwill one or the other might have, it's really rather silly to see:

"$4 minis from Paizo? Take my money!"

"$4 minis from WotC? Greedy corporate bastards!"

In much the same way that it's suspiciously weird to see frothing outrage when WotC does something and silence when Paizo later does the exact same thing.

 

[IronWolf]

If randomization stops people from buying your product, it's something you don't want.

Well - it depends on how many people will still buy your product even it is randomized. First, some people don't mind that it is randomized which seems to be a good number of people, though of course I only have various posting about the Internet to base that on. Second, some of the people that have stated they don't like randomization still admit they will purchase the product. It appears a much smaller category will flat out refuse to buy the minis simply due to randomization.

But the point of my post wasn't "BOOO RANDOMIZATION!", the point was "If they HAVE to randomize it, and randomization leads to its failure, how can ANYONE hope to hit the RPG minis market?"

How are you determining randomization leads to failure? Didn't WotC put out like 21 sets of randomized minis along they way? Not a bad run and not one that I would say was doomed to failure due to randomization.

 

[IronWolf]

Because, regardless of how much goodwill one or the other might have, it's really rather silly to see:

"$4 minis from Paizo? Take my money!"

"$4 minis from WotC? Greedy corporate bastards!"

In much the same way that it's suspiciously weird to see frothing outrage when WotC does something and silence when Paizo later does the exact same thing.

Heh - there has been a fair amount of people commenting on the pricing of these. So I think you might be trying to see something that isn't there. It certainly isn't silence on the pricing for these minis. Check out any number of posts here on these forums, Paizo forums or comments on various Paizo folks facebook posts.

 

[Nymrohd]

I still don't get why people buy minis in the first place . . . use tokens!

 

[MacMathan]

I am interested in these depending on how the production paints look.

I am wondering however why they are so much higher in price than WotC retail you would think a company like WK would have enough volume to provide competitive prices.

 

[kythri]

Heh - there has been a fair amount of people commenting on the pricing of these. So I think you might be trying to see something that isn't there. It certainly isn't silence on the pricing for these minis. Check out any number of posts here on these forums, Paizo forums or comments on various Paizo folks facebook posts.

Exactly.

And, as disenchanted as I am with WotC over all of their decisions, I'd still be paying them money for minis if they'd only be making them...

 

[Dannager]

Heh - there has been a fair amount of people commenting on the pricing of these. So I think you might be trying to see something that isn't there. It certainly isn't silence on the pricing for these minis. Check out any number of posts here on these forums, Paizo forums or comments on various Paizo folks facebook posts.

Oh I'm all up in that Paizo forum thread (defending Paizo, actually). But I know the usual suspects over there, and they're patting Paizo on the back for something they'd just as soon spit on WotC for doing.

 

[MerricB]

But the point of my post wasn't "BOOO RANDOMIZATION!", the point was "If they HAVE to randomize it, and randomization leads to its failure, how can ANYONE hope to hit the RPG minis market?"

Indeed.

Randomization has huge bonuses for stores (only one SKU), and it also brings the price down. "Miniatures at a cheap price" can be a bigger draw than "non-random expensive minis". I'm pretty sure it was a huge factor in why D&D Minis were initially so successful.

The way this line is being sold (large mini, or medium/2 small minis in pack) is very interesting indeed.

 

[I'm A Banana]

Well - it depends on how many people will still buy your product even it is randomized.
...
How are you determining randomization leads to failure?

Read my post again.

If randomization stops people from buying your product, it's something you don't want.
...
But the point of my post wasn't "BOOO RANDOMIZATION!", the point was "If they HAVE to randomize it, and randomization leads to its failure, how can ANYONE hope to hit the RPG minis market?"

See that little word, "if"?

That means, "This might not be the case, but here is some possibility that I see."

It's a tiny word, so perhaps you missed it.

Here, I will make it bigger:

IF

It is a pretty big if.

In fact, I even elaborated on how big of an if it might be:

That presupposes that randomization is a problem, which, for the market in general, it might not be.

I'm not entirely sure a failed minis line by WotC is the best counterexample, since, well, it ultimately failed (even if it did have a good run for a time), probably for several reasons, which may or may not include people going to the secondhand market instead of the primary market in order to collect individual minis, rather than buying from WotC, since they don't see any money from secondhand purchases (ie: one of the problems with randomization).

How do successful minis companies do it? (I honestly don't know, like I said, I'm not one for whom minis have ever held even the slightest appeal, randomized or not) How do the companies that randomize their minis remain profitable? How about the ones that don't?

Is it even possible to do a successful ongoing dedicated minis line for an RPG, given the specialized needs of RPG players versus other minis purchasers? Perhaps randomization is especially bad for RPG players, given that players and DMs usually have specific needs for their game? Perhaps not?

I mean, clearly, for over a decade now, more than one company has struggled mightily with actually producing a minis line for D&D (or a clone like Pathfinder). This shouldn't be such a problem, if the market really is there (and it sounds like it is). Why is this such a problem?

 

[Tanstaafl_au]

Did I get the prices right? $4 for one medium or 2 small minis, and $6 for one large mini? That's pretty pricey compared to WotC's prices.

Price seems silly esp. compared to price of secondary minis on eBay - which to be honest is what I expected from Paizo.

The reasoning for random is almost word for word what was said by WoTC reps way back. I hope it works for them for as long as it did for WoTC.