Paladin's & Sword of the Arcane Order

[Talonblaze]

So got a few questions about this feat that doesn't quite elaborate on what the rules pertaining to it are and I couldn't find clarifications to such.

-Are wizard/sorc spells subject to arcane spell failure even if they are prepared by the paladin/ranger slots? Or are they ignored? (Essentially are they treated like Divine Arcane spells or pure Arcane?)

-Does the feat allow you to qualify for arcane feats and abilities? Like for instance Obtain Familiar?

-It notes that caster levels for it is the sum of wizard (if any), paladin and ranger class levels. Does that mean that caster level = class levels for the purpose of these spells rather than a paladin's 1/2 + 2 caster level for their regular spells?

-Does Battle Blessing work with these spells?

-Would there be any point in buffing Int higher than 14 for the purpose of this feat since Paladin and Ranger spell slots don't go above 4th?

 

[emoplato]

So got a few questions about this feat that doesn't quite elaborate on what the rules pertaining to it are and I couldn't find clarifications to such.

-Are wizard/sorc spells subject to arcane spell failure even if they are prepared by the paladin/ranger slots? Or are they ignored? (Essentially are they treated like Divine Arcane spells or pure Arcane?)

-Does the feat allow you to qualify for arcane feats and abilities? Like for instance Obtain Familiar?

-It notes that caster levels for it is the sum of wizard (if any), paladin and ranger class levels. Does that mean that caster level = class levels for the purpose of these spells rather than a paladin's 1/2 + 2 caster level for their regular spells?

-Does Battle Blessing work with these spells?

-Would there be any point in buffing Int higher than 14 for the purpose of this feat since Paladin and Ranger spell slots don't go above 4th?

1. I am inclined to say yes since it says you prepare spells as if you are a wizard, your god doesn't give them to you they just allow you to have them. I really don't know entirely to be honest. There would have to be a specific rule saying whether open slots still are considered divine or arcane for the respected classes.
2. Yes, it would. You are a prepared caster that can cast up to 4th level spells.
3. It would seem by RAW at the very least a dip into it nets you full casting level.
4. No, battle blessing specifically says paladin spells, not slots or general spells.
5. It would if you want a higher save DC but I don't know of any feats that would allow you to swap charisma for intelligence for paladin abilities.

 

[nonsi256]

I am inclined to say yes since it says you prepare spells as if you are a wizard, your god doesn't give them to you they just allow you to have them. I really don't know entirely to be honest. There would have to be a specific rule saying whether open slots still are considered divine or arcane for the respected classes.

1. A paladin doesn't have to serve a deity.
2. It depends if they're cast as divine or arcane spells.

4. No, battle blessing specifically says paladin spells, not slots or general spells.

Once they're in the character's list, for all intents and purposes, for that character, they're considered Palading spells, unless it is specifically noted otherwise or there's a thumb rule in the PHB/DMG I've missed somehow.

 

[Talonblaze]

2. It depends if they're cast as divine or arcane spells.

Once they're in the character's list, for all intents and purposes, for that character, they're considered Palading spells, unless it is specifically noted otherwise or there's a thumb rule in the PHB/DMG I've missed somehow.

This is the current dilemma is the ones noted above since there is zero clarification. So far it only states for preparation, not the magic type or if it counts as a separate or added list. Since, like the Archivist they can prepare spells from numerous sources even though the source and methods don't change.

 

[emoplato]

This is the current dilemma is the ones noted above since there is zero clarification. So far it only states for preparation, not the magic type or if it counts as a separate or added list. Since, like the Archivist they can prepare spells from numerous sources even though the source and methods don't change.

Well Archivists can prepare any original divine spell. Some cleric domain spells are actually sorceror and wizard spells made divine by their god. Then there is the anyspell which is a 3rd level divine spell that automatically discharges any 2nd level or lower arcane spell. I know this is bouncing all over the place but the point is that I think they are full arcane spells because there is no in between meddling with them you only put them in your spell slots. However if their is a rule that says something to the extent that slots evoke arcane or divine descriptors then I am wrong, otherwise arcane spell failure as normal and feats.

 

[Talonblaze]

Well Archivists can prepare any original divine spell. Some cleric domain spells are actually sorceror and wizard spells made divine by their god. Then there is the anyspell which is a 3rd level divine spell that automatically discharges any 2nd level or lower arcane spell. I know this is bouncing all over the place but the point is that I think they are full arcane spells because there is no in between meddling with them you only put them in your spell slots. However if their is a rule that says something to the extent that slots evoke arcane or divine descriptors then I am wrong, otherwise arcane spell failure as normal and feats.

Well, the Archivist CAN learn domain spells via scrolls, just not books or natural selections as noted in the FAQs and other boards, so it does make me wonder how that plays out exactly.
Ask Wizards: 05/22/2007
There is no hint as to the spells via the feat being arcane or divine. Just whos class slots they use to prepare.

Even if they are Arcane in nature that seems rather fine. Was hoping BB would have worked for an added boost but I doubt that will swing in my favour.

I heard there were ways to change spell sources but was never able to get the sources noted as to where they are from. Such as Alternate Spell Source and Southern Magician and possibly others I don't know about. Any ideas about such or their sources?

 

[emoplato]

Well, the Archivist CAN learn domain spells via scrolls, just not books or natural selections as noted in the FAQs and other boards, so it does make me wonder how that plays out exactly.
Ask Wizards: 05/22/2007
There is no hint as to the spells via the feat being arcane or divine. Just whos class slots they use to prepare.

Even if they are Arcane in nature that seems rather fine. Was hoping BB would have worked for an added boost but I doubt that will swing in my favour.

I heard there were ways to change spell sources but was never able to get the sources noted as to where they are from. Such as Alternate Spell Source and Southern Magician and possibly others I don't know about. Any ideas about such or their sources?

Southern Magician is from the Races of Faerun and it allows for you to automatically change the nature of the spell once per day for every two caster levels. It also has some nice anti-abjurational effects -4 against enemy dispel or counterspelling. This definitely bypasses arcane penalties. Alternative source spell is a metamagic feat that is actually a multi-caster, two way version of this feat from Dragon Magazine 325. A level adjustment of 0 actually but a minor loss in caster level -1. I don't have the magazine but it is on Crystalkeep. It has the same language as this feat so yet again back to square one on the mystery. Many people claim it doesn't suffer arcane penalties preparing in a normally divine slot but actually don't have any proof. I would say the biggest benefit of this is if you have multiple spell slot trees so you can have more room to use whatever you may know. I say Southern Magician is your best bet to avoid the arcane penalties and get your DM on board.