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Please help me build a monk better at combat!

Roman

First Post
Lord Pendragon said:
What kind of armor/AC do Ragnar, Simon, and Castela have? If it's better than yours, I'd suggest you allow them to be the front-line. Not only will they be harder to hit, they can also heal themselves when they've taken significant damage.

I am not precisely sure about their AC, but it is definitely not better than my Monk's (only the fighter/ranger had better AC). It might be the same for some of them and lower for others. It is also worth considering that I have rolled well on hit points (our DM uses a roll twice and pick the better result method) and have the second highest hit point total - just after Ragnar. Jaris Slade 'the Tempted' has 64 hit points. :cool: Ragnar has 70 hp and the same strength as the monk (we use a roll in order stat generating system, though it is highly modified to give better stats). Ragnar is now definitely the group's primary fighter, but he alone is not enough. In contrast to the monk, Castela has about 40 hp and Simon perhaps 50 hp.

Then take Plane Sailing's advice and spend a feat for the guisarme (reach/trip) or spiked chain, so you can add melee damage from the second line.

Hmm, that sounds sensible, but that means the inability to do unarmed attacks/flurries/stunning fists.
 

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DanMcS

Explorer
Roman said:
Hmm, this is certainly worth considering.

Yeah. Spiked chain works for monks. I'm using one with my 11th level monk, and calling it a multi-section staff for flavor. Don't even have the exotic weapon proficiency yet, but I don't really need it. Using it for trip attacks is a touch attack, so the nonproficiency doesn't really hurt you. Does area denial on a large area, and works nicely with improved trip and combat reflexes. It has also come in handy using it to disarm; I faced four crossbowmen and had them all disarmed before they could fire with that weapon. Very nice.
 

Vargo

First Post
Roman said:
Why the "Oh" - are 3.5 monks significantly improved in some way?

YES!

First off, Flurry of Misses is now actually a useful attack - at 7th level your BAB becomes either +5 or +4/+4 - and when you hit 9th, your flurry penalty dissapears entirely. At 11th level, you get an additional attack at your full BAB - giving you a BAB of +8/+8/+8/+3. :eek:

That's enough in my book to take them from a nonparticipant class to a significant threat, especially to enemy spellcasters.
 

DanMcS

Explorer
Roman said:
Hmm, that sounds sensible, but that means the inability to do unarmed attacks/flurries/stunning fists.

Your reach weapon is wielded in your hands, you can still kick the area around you due to the unarmed strike abilities. Monk-fu intact.
 


Roman

First Post
DanMcS said:
Yeah. Spiked chain works for monks. I'm using one with my 11th level monk, and calling it a multi-section staff for flavor. Don't even have the exotic weapon proficiency yet, but I don't really need it. Using it for trip attacks is a touch attack, so the nonproficiency doesn't really hurt you. Does area denial on a large area, and works nicely with improved trip and combat reflexes. It has also come in handy using it to disarm; I faced four crossbowmen and had them all disarmed before they could fire with that weapon. Very nice.

That's pretty impressive. I am leaning more and more in this direction.
 

Roman

First Post
Vargo said:
YES!

First off, Flurry of Misses is now actually a useful attack - at 7th level your BAB becomes either +5 or +4/+4 - and when you hit 9th, your flurry penalty dissapears entirely. At 11th level, you get an additional attack at your full BAB - giving you a BAB of +8/+8/+8/+3. :eek:

That's enough in my book to take them from a nonparticipant class to a significant threat, especially to enemy spellcasters.

Whoa, that is indeed a significant upgrade. That means that at 20th level the monk with a flurry gets these attacks: +15/+15/+15/+12/+9/+6/+3 that is a total of 7 (unarmed BAB + flurry) attacks per round 3 of which are at full BAB!!!! Wow.
 

Lord Pendragon

First Post
Roman said:
Hmm, that sounds sensible, but that means the inability to do unarmed attacks/flurries/stunning fists.
As DanMcS pointed out, you can still perform all your monk abilities at 5', even while holding a 2-handed weapon, though of course--as I think you were pointing out--you wouldn't be able to use your monk abilities while attacking at 10' with the guisarme. It's a trade-off, really, and I'd suggested it because traditionally the front-line is not a good place for monks to be. :p
Roman said:
I am not precisely sure about their AC, but it is definitely not better than my Monk's (only the fighter/ranger had better AC). It might be the same for some of them and lower for others. It is also worth considering that I have rolled well on hit points (our DM uses a roll twice and pick the better result method) and have the second highest hit point total - just after Ragnar. Jaris Slade 'the Tempted' has 64 hit points. :cool: Ragnar has 70 hp and the same strength as the monk (we use a roll in order stat generating system, though it is highly modified to give better stats). Ragnar is now definitely the group's primary fighter, but he alone is not enough. In contrast to the monk, Castela has about 40 hp and Simon perhaps 50 hp.
This does change things, and I can now see why you posted this in the first place. Like it or not, you are the most logical choice for the second front-line combatant.

As that's the case, you're going to have to start thinking like a tank. A tank's main duty isn't necessarily to deal damage. It's to stay alive long enough for the enemy to be taken down. While engaging the enemy in melee to prevent that enemy from turning his attention onto the more tender and juicy PCs in the back. That said, you'll have to start thinking about what every tank is thinking about.

1. Raise your AC. With an int of 10, Combat Expertise is out, which is unfortunate. Keep in mind that you can Fight Defensively and, because you have 5 ranks in Tumble, gain a +3 to AC for a -4 to attacks. Against tougher foes, this can keep you alive long enough for your party to take a baddie down. If you find yourself needing to block a doorway as a delaying tactic (recently my paladin need to do this to prevent new foes from entering a room while we were still fighting others,) consider Total Defense for +4 to AC, though you lose the opportunity to attack (including AoOs.)

2. Raise your hp. Here you're actually in good condition. +3 con bonus is nice, and you've rolled well. Still, as the front-line tank, you can never have enough hp! Start looking for a con-boosting item (if they exist in your game, which looks to be extremely low magic).
 

rangerjohn

Explorer
Roman said:
Whoa, that is indeed a significant upgrade. That means that at 20th level the monk with a flurry gets these attacks: +15/+15/+15/+12/+9/+6/+3 that is a total of 7 (unarmed BAB + flurry) attacks per round 3 of which are at full BAB!!!! Wow.

No, +15/+15/+15/10/5.
 


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