Preserving the Fear Inherent in 1st Level

[Reynard]

Don’t balance encounters.
Limit their time.
Do good random encounters.
Same as it ever was IMO

I feel like a lot of responses boil down to this idea of taxing resources and pushing PCs to their limits. That's not really what I am asking though.

Low level fights are fun because they are swingy and dangerous and uncertain. That's more what I am asking.

 

[CAFRedblade]

Toss more small encounters at them, let them use more resources before the mid and boss combats to be more constrained. Don't give em a chance to short rest.

Return Massive Damage rules to the game. On a strike of 50hp (or more) the player gets an automatic Failed Death Save. Also apply a Failed Death Save on Crits against PC's.
Can't kill you unless you fall to zero HP, but you're bleeding all over the place if you have 3 failed saves and are still standing.

Use longer Short and Long Rest recovery, and limit HD recovery.

All kind of things you can do to make things a little more lethal.

I use the Perkins Crit rule. Maximum base damage and then roll, can lead to some spectacular hits for some PC's and NPCs alike.

 

[Guest 6801328]

More minions.

 

[Staccat0]

I feel like a lot of responses boil down to this idea of taxing resources and pushing PCs to their limits. That's not really what I am asking though.

Low level fights are fun because they are swingy and dangerous and uncertain. That's more what I am asking.

Yeah, I think other D&D-likes work really hard to preserve that. 5e isn’t really about that, but more about feeling tangible growth.

That said, I have found that I can get back to that feeling occasionally through attrition and allowing dungeons to sometimes be swarming with monsters or house some really powerful creatures that can still one hit someone.

it gets harder as they level. You could hack 5e to be more like that by having almost everything damage stats but it seems easier to just play a game that feels that way

 

[Yunru]

Low level fights are fun because they are swingy and dangerous and uncertain. That's more what I am asking.

Fun for whom? The party that now has to abandon their quest for the day? The DM who now has to factor in a day's downtime and more resources for the next level?

Low level fights aren't dangerous and uncertain, low resource fights are. Which is what the adventuring day is designed for.

 

[Guest 6801328]

Oh, and in addition to making rests difficult so you drain their resources, don't forget to put obstacles behind them so they can't just waltz out of the dungeon whenever they feel like it.

 

[Reynard]

Low level fights aren't dangerous and uncertain, low resource fights are. Which is what the adventuring day is designed for.

I disagree. 9th level characters running low on resources aren't just 1st level characters again. There are a whole host of mechanical elements of levels that aren't just "x spells per day" or HP inflation. Likewise you could give a 1st level barbarian unlimited uses of Rage and it wouldn't play like a 20th level barbarian.

 

[Guest 6801328]

I disagree. 9th level characters running low on resources aren't just 1st level characters again. There are a whole host of mechanical elements of levels that aren't just "x spells per day" or HP inflation. Likewise you could give a 1st level barbarian unlimited uses of Rage and it wouldn't play like a 20th level barbarian.

That's all true. AND when those 9th level characters run low on spell slots and HP and Action Surges and the like, combats can be very touch and go.

(Especially if you block their egress and throw extra minions in the fight.)

And, unlike with that 1st level character, now you've got hours and hours of time invested in the character.

EDIT: Look, I totally agree with the point of your thread. I love low level games for exactly the reason you are describing. But I think the solutions people are proposing in this thread also work.

 

[Reynard]

That's all true. AND when those 9th level characters run low on spell slots and HP and Action Surges and the like, combats can be very touch and go.

(Especially if you block their egress and throw extra minions in the fight.)

And, unlike with that 1st level character, now you've got hours and hours of time invested in the character.

EDIT: Look, I totally agree with the point of your thread. I love low level games for exactly the reason you are describing. But I think the solutions people are proposing in this thread also work.

For sure. I don't want it to seem like I am being dismissive. I was just quibbling with the idea that taxed resources at higher level was the same as low level play. I appreciate that you can wring a lot of tension out of pushing your mid to high level PCs to their limits. It's just not the same kind of tension as low level characters wading into those first dozen or so encounters. And that's probably okay. The game is built with steady progression in mind, after all, and 5e does a pretty good job of flattening the power curve so low level threats don't become obsolete so soon.

 

[Yunru]

I was just quibbling with the idea that taxed resources at higher level was the same as low level play.

Oh, not at all. If anything it's worse. Sure back then you might of died, but you might of died to anything. Now you might die because the enemy is just that strong. D: