Profanities

[BoGGiT]

Hello everyone!

I'm curious about something; why are people here (especially americans) so uptight when it comes to profanities? I'm thinking partly of the forum rules, but also of the general attitude. For example, a thread in the RPG forum where someone mentioned how awful it was that the employees in the local gaming store used an "obscene" language when talking to each other.

I don't mean to step on anyone's toes, but I still find this to be quite peculiar. I guess it partly has to do with cultural differences between the USA in general and, for example, my rather typical swedish rural-atheist-working class upbringing where pretty much everyone around me used that kind of language, but I still don't think that we swedes are any more rude or obscene than most other people and cultures.

And motivating the rules with having 13 year olds feeling comfortable whilst browsing the forums? Are you kidding me? I must have been seven or eight when I first learned the F-word (in english, I mean), and I doubt it's much different overseas.

 

[EricNoah]

I'm not sure I can explain it but ... where I'm from, it's really creepy and wrong to swear around children. It's just gross. In some situations it can be considered harassment. I happen to be a guy who swears like a sailor in private. But what I do in private is my business. What I do in public becomes everyone's business.

When I established the rules on the forums originally (back when they were the forums for Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D Third Edition News), the goal was to make it a comfortable place for as many people as possible. Some people don't like profanity, it makes them uncomfortable. The acid test I used was my own grandmother -- if it would make my grandma cringe, if I would be embarassed to take her on a tour of the forums, then something was wrong. It's really as simple (and as complex) as that. I'm glad Morrus kept the rule around.

 

[bento]

As a father of two young kids (6 & 10) I'm wary of them hearing that kind of language too soon. I picked it up in about 2nd grade and had the good sense of knowing when to use it and when not to. My oldest thinks "hell" is a bad word, and I want her to continue thinking this for as long as she wants to.

In public I don't cuss because it makes some people uncomfortable, and it makes me look like I have either a poor vocabulary or little self-control. Private conversation are a different matter, but I don't start unless the other person does.

 

[nerfherder]

The UK is similar to the US for swearing - it's not done in front of the children.

 

[Thornir Alekeg]

I don't mean to step on anyone's toes, but I still find this to be quite peculiar. I guess it partly has to do with cultural differences between the USA in general and, for example, my rather typical swedish rural-atheist-working class upbringing where pretty much everyone around me used that kind of language, but I still don't think that we swedes are any more rude or obscene than most other people and cultures.

And yet, if you were to routinely use profanity, some other people would consider you to be more rude and obscene. It is all about perspective.

 

[Marius Delphus]

In general, it's a social convention: maintaining an air of politeness demands refraining from words deemed obscene. On the matter of children, it's an extension of the principle: if one intends to teach one's children to be polite, one refrains from swearing in their hearing, teaching thus by example.

In the case of English, there's an interesting bit of trivia involving profanity: most monosyllabic English terms now deemed obscene originated in Anglo-Saxon, whereas their multisyllabic synonyms not deemed obscene originated in Latin and French. The implication is that, as the English language evolved after 1066, at need one used the "cultured" Latin or French term, if one intended to appear civilized, rather than the "vulgar" Anglo-Saxon term, which caused one to appear "common" and uncivilized.

In fact, IMO it *is* "awful" to hear sales clerks use profanity. The customer's vocabulary is not at issue: the lack of social grace in the sales clerk is. Workers who face the public are generally expected, as a condition of their employment, to maintain an air of politeness, which brings us neatly back to my first point.

 

[frankthedm]

In fact, IMO it *is* "awful" to hear sales clerks use profanity. The customer's vocabulary is not at issue: the lack of social grace in the sales clerk is. Workers who face the public are generally expected, as a condition of their employment, to maintain an air of politeness, which brings us neatly back to my first point.

If everyone in the store is in the same age group and look like a bunch of metalheads, it would not bug me if the clerk swore. The more mixed the group, however, the more the clerk needs to put on the False Retail Face and watch the language.

 

[BoGGiT]

First of all, my post was in no way intended as criticism against the forum rules, more as a curious inquiry, because I find the matter interesting.

Anyway, I tend to use really vulgar profanities (equivalents of the f-word, the c-word et cetera) very sparesly in public myself, but few people around here would be bothered much by it. It is definitly not uncommon to hear them in prime-time television, and even though I don't have any kids yet myself, my experiences are that even if most parents would tell their children not to use such words, it's not considered to be a big deal. In many cases parents even have a hard time hiding their amusement when their four-year olds try to use "grownup vocabulary", though they would pretend to be at least somewhat upset.

 

[Jdvn1]

First of all, my post was in no way intended as criticism against the forum rules, more as a curious inquiry, because I find the matter interesting.

Anyway, I tend to use really vulgar profanities (equivalents of the f-word, the c-word et cetera) very sparesly in public myself, but few people around here would be bothered much by it. It is definitly not uncommon to hear them in prime-time television, and even though I don't have any kids yet myself, my experiences are that even if most parents would tell their children not to use such words, it's not considered to be a big deal. In many cases parents even have a hard time hiding their amusement when their four-year olds try to use "grownup vocabulary", though they would pretend to be at least somewhat upset.

It also depends on the people you spend time around. I've been to some places where every other word is a profanity. It took some getting used to, for me.

Profanity is insulting to some. Not using profanity is insulting to no one.

 

[bento]

Not taken as a criticism of the forum BoGGiT!

It got me thinking about language though. I've lived most my life in Texas, but I do not have any trace of a southern or Texan accent, which people often remark on when they first meet me. I joke that it comes from watching so much TV as a kid.

I think the real reason I strive to have NO ACCENT is because my grandfather had such a hard regional (Arkansas) accent that I could barely understand him when he spoke. Much of what he said either sounded like mumbles or long drawn out vowel sounds. "Wall weer goin dun ta tha store naw."

How we handle language is how we're wired as social animals. We learn to do certain things in part due to upbringing, and in other IN SPITE of our upbringing. Probably for all profanity hibitions in front of my kids, they'll be swearing like sailors in another ten years.