Raging Undead Duration

[Varius]

Do you think it would be unbalancing to let undead substitute charisma for constitution for the duration of thier rage?

The way I look at it is spell casters can substitute cha for con when using concentration, and for psionics the Savant can sub cha for con for his ability.


BTW I know some people don't believe undead can rage, but that is beside the point

 

[hong]

No, I don't think it's unbalancing at all. Just make sure your players are aware of this house rule if you spring raging undead on them.

And speaking of which, wouldn't "Raging Undead" be a great name for a rock band?

 

[Varius]

Why yes it would

 

[Crothian]

No, I don't think it's unbalancing at all. Just make sure your players are aware of this house rule if you spring raging undead on them.

And speaking of which, wouldn't "Raging Undead" be a great name for a rock band?

I agree with hong. However, you might not want to mention it to the PCs, other wise they will expect it.

We come up with more Rock Band neames......

 

[Weeble]

Ironically, I'm going to have a raging undead in my campaign soon. I might use Cha for raging purposes too, although for my NPC, it won't make much of a difference. I also would not tell the PCs about the house rule before hand for reasons stated above, but unless the NPC's Cha is very high, they might not even notice. If they do, they are metagaming to the hilt, part of the definition of munchkinism to me.

 

[Crothian]

If they do, they are metagaming to the hilt, part of the definition of munchkinism to me.

Meta gaming isn't being a munchkin. Personally, if my DM used raging undead andf I noticed the rage lasting longer then 3 rounds I'd ask about it afterwards. It could be he changed the rules, or it could be he was unclear on them. DM's make mistakes. A PC can metagame to make sure the game is fair, but she needs to do it at the proper time and in a polite manner.

 

[Magus_Jerel]

First off - an undead barbarian CAN rage; but they have a "nonability" in their constitution score.

nonabilities: Some creatures lack ability scores. These creatures do not have an ability score of 0; they lack the ability altogether. The modifier for a non-ability is +0.

As undead barbarians lack constitution - the "bonus" to the constitution score that comes with a rage is negated. The barbarian only gets three round of such rage - which is bad.

The way I look at it is spell casters can substitute cha for con when using concentration, and for psionics the Savant can sub cha for con for his ability.

By default - neither is true.

now - if you rule that a character without a con score substitutes their cha modifier, that's fine - but this rule would then apply to their fortitude saves. particularly in the case of sorcerer or paladin turned undead (and in the case of paladin ex-paladin) It would also affect their hit point calculation, and both are VERY unbalancing.

Furthermore; if they can actually use their charisma score as if it were their constitution score, and the psionics rules are in place, it allows them to do things they really shouldn't be able to do. Undead psions just can't use "con based" powers at all - they don't have the requisite score. It still leaves them with 5 other sets of powers to choose from.

It is a "modification" that is a slippery slope. Granted, you aren't likely to have PC's who desire to become undead... but anything can happen...

 

[Varius]

I am the PC

 

[Lily Inverse]

Well, actually. . . .

There IS some justification for using Charisma instead of Constitution for an undead to power their special abilities. A body (a living one) relies on its endurance to keep going and to "fuel" certain special abilities like Rage. When there isn't a constitution score keeping things moving, something else needs to. In the case of undead, usually its the force of their personality that lets the body keep moving after it should stop, thus Charisma works in place of Constitution for the puposes of special abilities only.