D&D 4E Realistic Strength and Carrying Capacity for 4E

[Roman]

I think (mostly intuitively - I don't really have RL numbers to compare) that in 3.X edition, the carrying capacity table overestimates average strength and carrying capacity. Heroes are, of course, above average, but that is reflected in their higher than average stats, not in the stats themselves being skewed upwards. When realism and gameplay clash, gameplay wins, but since in this case they don't really clash (encumberance, for example, is generally only assessed when players try to carry a clearly ridiculous amount of stuff), it would be nice to have some realistic numbers.

According to the carrying capacity table, a strength 10 individual can carry 100 pounds of equipment and lift/stagger with 200 pounds and a strength 11 inividual can carry 115 pounds and lift/stagger with 230 pounds. I feel this is way too much - I cannot really imagine an average person lifting 230 pounds off the ground and staggering with it (and this is different from benchpress or similar exercises). On the other hand, I must say I do not know how much an average person can lift off the ground - anybody has any numbers on that? If it were up to you, what carrying capacity would you assign to each strength score to make it more realistic?

 

[Mr Jack]

Carrying 115 pounds is like giving your skinny girlfriend a piggyback; most blokes can do that without trouble.

Lifting 230 pounds and staggering about it is like picking up your rugby playing mate and stumbling a few feet forward. Most blokes can do that.

I don't think the numbers are too bad, really. Personally I'd like to see carrying capacity got rid of and replaced with a simpler system; but that's probably just me.

 

[wedgeski]

I agree with Mr. Jack... I think the average numbers are pretty good. Now, the problem is scaling them into heroic 18+ scores, where the sheer volume of goods that a character can carry is absurd. I wouldn't really mind seeing carrying capacity dumped from the game altogether.

Have any table-top RPG's used a 'slot' system like Diablo or WoW? I wonder if that could work in a proper RPG, where each item was listed not in terms of weight, but in terms of equipment slots used.

 

[Firevalkyrie]

If they make carrying capacity more realistic, I also hope that they make weights more realistic... four pounds for an arming sword (longsword) is about twice what it should actually weigh, same with six for a bastard sword and eight for a greatsword.

Encumbrance, too - a knight in a full harness might be carrying more excess weight around than a modern infantryman in full kit, but it's better distributed, so he notices it less.

 

[Numion]

According to the carrying capacity table, a strength 10 individual can carry 100 pounds of equipment and lift/stagger with 200 pounds and a strength

Finland has a mandatory military service, so everyone has to go. In that sense, not only the strong end up in the military so avg STR of 10 could be assumed. The full pack can easily weight 100 lbs, and everyone could carry it for extended periods (first time in full gear I thought it would be impossible to go more than a couple of kilometers).

In another instance (her idea) a 110 pound woman claimed she could carry me piggyback. 210 lbs. She could only stagger a few feet, but that's what happened.

Or maybe my life is broken, and doesn't use encumbrance rules.

 

[Klaus]

Those numbers seem about right.

A Spartan hoplite was considered a marvel for being able to march around all day carring 60 pounds of equipment (including armor). That'd be Str 14-15 (Light Load).

The current world record for clean and jerking (= Lifting Over Head in two stages) is 580.9 lbs. The record for snatching (= Lifting Over Head in one swoop) is 469.6 lbs. Either of those would put the record-holder at Str 23.

 

[Haffrung Helleyes]

realistic strength

I don't have a problem with the range for humans, but if they want strength to be realistic, they need to do something about halflings.

Right now, it is easy in the game to make a halfling that is way stronger than the average human. That doesn't seem reasonable to me, given the relative sizes of halflings and humans.

Or they could just get rid of the little varmints!

Ken

 

[Sadrik]

I don't want realistic carrying capacity!

I want a system something like:
STR score + SIZE mod equals your ENC points and then every item costs a certain number of ENC points- add up ENC points and compare it to two categories- burdened (x2ENC) and unburdened (x1ENC).

This is a game after all and probably one of the least used rules are the encumbrance rules. I say simplify them.

 

[Cbas_10]

I don't want realistic carrying capacity!

I want a system something like:
STR score + SIZE mod equals your ENC points and then every item costs a certain number of ENC points- add up ENC points and compare it to two categories- burdened (x2ENC) and unburdened (x1ENC).

This is a game after all and probably one of the least used rules are the encumbrance rules. I say simplify them.

Agreed. Maybe not that specific formula...but a simpler system would be great. While I don't like the "slots" idea, as it gives little in the way of representing weight, something should be done about the volume of stuff a character is carrying. Get a decent level fighter (or whatever the class will be) with a tremendous strength...and he can carry a LOT when measured simply by pounds. However, how much "space" does he have to hold it all? One huge backpack that sticks out 4 feet back and 5 feet up over his head?

 

[Klaus]

I don't have a problem with the range for humans, but if they want strength to be realistic, they need to do something about halflings.

Right now, it is easy in the game to make a halfling that is way stronger than the average human. That doesn't seem reasonable to me, given the relative sizes of halflings and humans.

Or they could just get rid of the little varmints!

Ken

Bump them to -4 Str, +4 Dex and be done with it.