Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil(Full)

[DarkMaster]

All we need now is a rogue that could go scout with my barbarian and prepare devastating surprise attack and then we would finish them off flanking them.

Ok that's just me dreaming. But seriously since we are going to spend a lot of time in a dungeon I would feel better with someone that can disable those nasty traps and open locked door without having my portable ram alerting the whole dungeon of our presence.

I guess another Warrior would also be useful

 

[Wystan]

If you still have room for one more I would like to play and will have the character (A rogue) tomorrow for your approval.

Thank you

Please let me know at wcurtiskpmg (at) hotmail (dot) com

 

[Ferrix]

I've a question, if I use an illusion to create a warrior or someone who "flanked" an opponent with another actual character, would the actual character get the flanking benefits if the opponent being flanked believed the illusion?

 

[DarkMaster]

I think that should be adressed in the rule section.

I would allow it for a round or more for a very stupid opponent.

 

[Ankh-Morpork Guard]

I've a question, if I use an illusion to create a warrior or someone who "flanked" an opponent with another actual character, would the actual character get the flanking benefits if the opponent being flanked believed the illusion?

That's one of those things that's been discussed over and over in Rules. I say no, and most seem to agree because flanking requires another ALLY. An Illusion isn't an ally.

And Wystan, you've got the spot once I see a character!

 

[Ferrix]

Mind if I try a counter-argument?

Hopefully, you don't.

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If my opponent believes the illusion is an ally of the other flanker, would it not then serve exactly the same purpose that an ally would? If the opponent has failed his save against the illusion, wouldn't he then react exactly in the same manner to the "illusionary" ally, as he would to a real ally?

Just because the ally isn't real in a very specific sense doesn't seem to mitigate the effects that a double that is believed to be real would have upon the situation. It doesn't even matter if the opponent was really smart or not, if he fails his will save, he believes the illusion is real and thus should react accordingly should he not?

Do you have any links to any other discussions on this?

 

[Ankh-Morpork Guard]

You have to be able to threaten to provide the flanking bonus...and while the Illusion would obviously worry the opponent, the image can't threaten him at all, so can't provide the ally with a +2.

I'm currently far too lazy(ironic, eh?) to hunt down the threads on this right now. But if you come across anything convincing enuogh, I'll think about it.

 

[jpwic]

Heheh, so that makes what so far, A druid, a fighter and maybe a rogue.. Hmm, we seem to be lacking in the arcane magic support, although I will be exceptionally sumonny..

Apparently I can't read, I totally forgot about Ferrix, I'm really sorry about that

 

[DarkMaster]

Your the DM Ankh, I will play by your rule and I won't add more than this post on the subject but I am on Ferrix side. I beleive that the flanking bonus is caused by the distraction more than by the physical presence. The proof an invisible ally threathening your opponent with melee weapon doesn't provide a flanking bonus so logically (twisted logic) an illusionary visible opponent should provide a bonus. I think it's all a question of being aware of the opponent and having to split your attention between two opposite foes.

Ferrix, after a rounds or two a smart opponent would notice that the illusionary opponent never attack or when he does his blow have no effect and would therefore ignore the illusionary opponent thus fully concentrating on the real opponent and depriving him of the flanking bonus.

I also beleive that Illusions are usually a bit underpowered and never mind to boost them a little bit.

This is just the way I handle this situation in my games and hopefully we don't transform this thread in another of those never ending battle.

Hope we can get the rogue soon and begin

 

[Ankh-Morpork Guard]

How about this?

I shall think about it