Science Fiction in Your Fantasy Game?

[tomBitonti]

I'm thinking the difference is more in the areas of player outlook and presentation:

That is whether "how things work" is based on a material, scientific principles "laser" or on magical principles "wand of searing light".

There is a question of how the magic is presented: Physics, with new fundamental abilities in the mix? The will of the gods, filtered through mortals? Soul-energy?

In D&D, at least, there is somewhat of a mix on the edges: Psionics originally had a sci-fi theme (probability travel, anyone?) Chaositect mixes chaos magic with technology. Eberron pushes the edges with magical levitating trains and factories for intelligent golems.

Mind you, a lot of sci-fi is fantasy (a laser, of most achievable powers, would create surface burns and deeper damage by vapor explosion); worm-holes and faster than light travel are mostly nonsense. On the other hand, information technology, some genetics, (maybe) AI, rail guns, explosives, and so forth are real.

Thx!

TomB

 

[Umbran]

I wonder how the people who vote no see Star Wars and how they would categorize it.

As I said above - science fantasy. Or perhaps Space Opera. In Star Wars, if you replace the spaceships with horses, you get the same story, and it's a fantasy story.

Since when is sci-fi "extrapolation of current technological developments"? It is science...fiction.

Oh, well if putting emphasis is how to make the point. It is science fiction. If there's no science in it, it isn't science fiction.

To quote a couple of relevant folks:

Robert A. Heinlein said, "a handy short definition of almost all science fiction might read: realistic speculation about possible future events, based solidly on adequate knowledge of the real world, past and present, and on a thorough understanding of the nature and significance of the scientific method."

Rod Serling defined it thusly: "Fantasy is the impossible made probable. Science fiction is the improbable made possible."

 

[Sage Genesis]

I'm another one who is unsure if there's a really useful, clear distinction between the two. Even Conan has met a space alien. Trying to lump works like Star Wars, He-Man, or Thundercats exclusively into one or the other is at best a pointless exercise for the sake of labels.

D&D is another such work where the exact distinction is unclear. It's just such a mess of different influences and inclusions, I'm not sure if it's really anything other than "D&D" at this point.

 

[Umbran]

I'm another one who is unsure if there's a really useful, clear distinction between the two.

I'll grant that the distinction isn't clear. It is a genre definition, after all, and those are always fuzzy.

However, I find the distinction to be quite useful, in that each genre has its own tropes and themes. There's no police department going to come and take you away if you mix and match them. But, your audience has expectations, and one ought to be careful in mucking around with those expectations.

 

[SkidAce]

There are a multitude of books and novels where the setting is fantasy and medieval, but the magic results from scientific principles. Marion Zimmer Bradley, Keeper of the Keys by Janny Wurts, Cold Fire Trilogy by C.S. Friedman etc etc etc. They are on my shelf but not enough time to list them all.

Our gaming heritage came from books and such, so I'm cool with it, even though every campaign or adventure is not like that.

I pick and choose my creative tools.

 

[Quentin3212]

I think that a lot of people posting here are right and that it really is just a case of expectations. For example when I am playing d&d I expect things to be magical not scientific. That doesn't mean you can't explain exactly how magic works, it just means I am going in expecting to not see any science based technologies equivalent or superior to that used by the modern world.

For example I once played in a game where the DM sort of sprung a barrier peaks module on us without letting us know what to expect and I found it quite jarring to walk through a portal in neverwinter into what we at the time thought was a moon base, resplendent with sliding doors, portal guns, and computers. I'm not saying I can't enjoy something like that, but I like to know what I'm getting into because it can really affect my ability to immerse myself in the world.

 

[Yora]

It's science!

"Space ships and lasers not a Sci-Fi writer you make!"

Fantasy and Science Fiction really only have in common that they require the audience to accept a number of elements about the world of the story, that neither exist, nor are currently possible in their normal life. Other than that, there is barely any overlap that doesn't also match regular action and adventure movies set in the real world.
The themes and dynamics of fantasy and science fiction are very much different.

In any case, I don't consider Star Wars to be a case of futuristic technology being dumped into a world that does not have electricity. Which I think totally sucks.

 

[The Crimson Binome]

The question isn't whether something counts as sci-fi or fantasy, in some academic sense, but how badly is it going to throw off your groove if you see it in your game? If you show up to a Forgotten Realms game, and see an alien space-warble from the vermouth nebula, then that doesn't feel right; if it's presented as a chaos beast from the far realms, then that isn't going to break your expectations as much. Even if it's otherwise the exact same thing.

If you're talking to a demon, and she mentions how demons came to this world ten thousand years ago in a space ship, then that's kind of like "doing in the wizard". It's not a nice thing to just spring on an unsuspecting player.

 

[TarionzCousin]

???

Tricksy!

I draw the line at guns. I have never allowed guns in my D&D or Pathfinder games.

If a setting has guns, like the Three Musketeers, it isn't pure pseudo-medieval "fantasy" to me. Gaming in the Renaissance isn't like gaming in Greyhawk.

If a setting has laser pistols, it's science fiction. It might even be science fantasy, but it isn't plain "fantasy," IMHO.

 

[Dungeoneer]

Cool topic!

I am very interested in using sci-fi concepts and tropes in fantasy worlds. I'm not talking about the TRAPPINGS of sci-fi: a laser gun does not science fiction make.

I think Dark Sun actually whet my appetite with its psionics. Then I actually realized that I had been uunconsciously incorporating sci-fi elements in several of the settings of the last few games I ran, working subtle sci-fi 'weirdness' into them for the players to stumble across. Now I am kicking around the idea of a homebrew setting where there is a lot sci-fi tropes: time travel; cloning; mechanical automatons; ships that sail between worlds; alien parasites and viruses; mind control.

Of course D&D has been flirting with the edges of some of these for years. But I'd like to see a setting that dives in headfirst. Sci-fi gets so much mileage out of these tropes. Why shouldn't fantasy have some of the fun too?