Seeking Ideas to Build a Brass Dragon Cohort

[Gavinfoxx]

The Druid Spell Entangle? It's a level 1 spell... Druids can do that from first level... and there are lots of other spells they get that can do that. And they can heal. And they are great in melee. AND they have a fighter as a class feature...

 

[TanisFrey]

Gavinfoxx, I know how useful the entangle spell is, even when character at 13th or 14th level and facing opponents of that power. If a brass dragon could take druid spells I would have taken entangle as one of his choices. Brass dragons get Sorcerer, Cleric, Chaos and Knowledge spells on their spell list to choose known spells. A young dragon has a effective caster level of 1, allowing him to know 2 first level spells.

I am talking about a feat that says the victim is entangled. As far as I know nothing in the PBH or DMG inflicts the entangle condition, there may be some monster in the Monster Manual. Given the lack of things that cause the entangle condition, I confused the spell effects with the condition effects when reading the feat effects from Races of the Dragon.

 

[Gavinfoxx]

I am talking about a feat that says the victim is entangled. As far as I know nothing in the PBH or DMG inflicts the entangle condition, there may be some monster in the Monster Manual. Given the lack of things that cause the entangle condition, I confused the spell effects with the condition effects when reading the feat effects from Races of the Dragon.

Ah, right, I've had to look up the effects of the condition myself sometimes. Still, RotD Entangling Exhalation is pretty nice. Why not ask how to optimize a Brass Dragon on Brilliantgameologists?

My personal suggestion would be "Abrupt Jaunt Conjurer (PHB II) Spellhoarding (Dragon Magazine #313) Loredrake (Dragons of Eberron)". This makes him a Wizard Conjurer, improves the spells he has access to, gives him a good alternate class feature, and gives him a neat spellbook sort of thing. Then he focuses on support spells and breaths, and massively increases his spell list.

 

[TanisFrey]

Ah, right, I've had to look up the effects of the condition myself sometimes. Still, RotD Entangling Exhalation is pretty nice. Why not ask how to optimize a Brass Dragon on Brilliantgameologists?

My personal suggestion would be "Abrupt Jaunt Conjurer (PHB II) Spellhoarding (Dragon Magazine #313) Loredrake (Dragons of Eberron)". This makes him a Wizard Conjurer, improves the spells he has access to, gives him a good alternate class feature, and gives him a neat spellbook sort of thing. Then he focuses on support spells and breaths, and massively increases his spell list.

I will look at Abrupt Jaunt Conjurer.
It is a Forgotten Realms game, we (my gaming group) don't like to mix worlds too much. We are ok with importing the Complete Books' Grayhawk stuff, if it can be made to fit.
WE almost never use 3rd party or Dragon Magazine stuff. I don't think I own that issue, has someone posted it online some were?

 

[Gavinfoxx]

I will look at Abrupt Jaunt Conjurer.
It is a Forgotten Realms game, we (my gaming group) don't like to mix worlds too much. We are ok with importing the Complete Books' Grayhawk stuff, if it can be made to fit.
WE almost never use 3rd party or Dragon Magazine stuff. I don't think I own that issue, has someone posted it online some were?

Oh, it's not too hard to get that issue. I'm sure its as easy as an appropriate google search. But, uh, is that topic allowed on this forum?

 

[TanisFrey]

From what I am reading on the net and looking in PBHII;

Abrupt Jaunt - interesting, may want this if he get wizard levels.

Spellhorder - swap effective sorcerer levels for effective wizard levels neet, I even have that issue. DM and other players are critical of many things in Dragon Mags as being unbalanced. But if the cohort has to give up access to cleric and the domain spells it's a deal breaker. I will have him look at it.

Loredrake - also neat but I don't own the book. Adds actual sorcerer casting levels, which is better than practiced spellcaster. He would get more spells per day instead of a +4 caster level. (Yes, I know that they could stack.) Just mentioning Eberon will makes the group cringe as we DO NOT want Psionics at all. There are a couple of local gaming stores for me go to to see if they have this book.

Thanks for the ideas.

 

[Gavinfoxx]

TanisFray:
So... if he got an actual level of Conjurer (banning, say, Evocation or something), AND he got Loredrake, AND he then used Spellhoarder to change his Sorcerer level (upped by Loredrake) to Wizard... then he would actually be a relatively good caster! Then focus his feats on casting and battlefield control with the breath, and you're set to go!

Lessee... Young is 1st level sorcerer, Loredrake makes it 3rd level sorcerer, Spellhoarding makes it 3rd level WIZARD, which gives him *second level spells*, to which you add a level of Conjurer ASAP, and then you immediately Prestige Class him into some Wizardly prestige class of awesomeness, as soon as you can... Have him focus on spells that work even with a low caster level (Glitterdust!), and Entangling Exhalation, and you're good to go!

 

[TanisFrey]

I do understand you build concept, it just almost every thing from a dragon magazine article had no play testing to see if it is balanced.

I am already running a Priestess of Sharess, spells per day 11 cleric and bard 1; actual caster level = cleric 13 to19; bard 1 ( can argue up to + 4 levels here). The actual class levels are Bard 1/Cleric 6/Half-Elf Paragon 2/Divine Disciple 4 with practiced spell caster and a preform skill maxed. She can use the bard music ability to inspire greatness to fully use the practiced spell caster and has divine spellpower to boost it father. Turn check modifier is +10 (+8 cha, +2 religion skill) without using the domains of Charm and Lust.

This character is complex without me adding a reality powerful spell casting dragon. I want to keep the dragon build relatively simple in comparison.

And the DM has just said no to anything from a dragon magazine or from Eberon. The email came in as I was typing, my iphone buzzed it my way.

 

[Gavinfoxx]

I do understand you build concept, it just almost every thing from a dragon magazine article had no play testing to see if it is balanced.

I am already running a Priestess of Sharess, spells per day 11 cleric and bard 1; actual caster level = cleric 13 to19; bard 1 ( can argue up to + 4 levels here). The actual class levels are Bard 1/Cleric 6/Half-Elf Paragon 2/Divine Disciple 4 with practiced spell caster and a preform skill maxed. She can use the bard music ability to inspire greatness to fully use the practiced spell caster and has divine spellpower to boost it father. Turn check modifier is +10 (+8 cha, +2 religion skill) without using the domains of Charm and Lust.

This character is complex without me adding a reality powerful spell casting dragon. I want to keep the dragon build relatively simple in comparison.

And the DM has just said no to anything from a dragon magazine or from Eberon. The email came in as I was typing, my iphone buzzed it my way.

I guess I would focus on breath stuff. There are lots of feats -- mostly from races of the dragon and draconomicon -- that improve the breath weapon. Entangling Exhalation, Exhaled Barrier, Clinging Breath, Enlarge Breath, maybe some ability focus, stuff like that.