Simple House Rule for Ritual Casting - thoughts?

[eriktheguy]

Hmm..
The casting system suggested above could work without any slots or memorization. Simply allow players to cast rituals that they know in combat, expend the components, and be done with it.

Edit: Been thinking about it some more, and I don't like the memorization or slots either. Here's why. As with many others on ENWorld I am the DM, not the players. My players don't like houserules nearly as much as me, and probably wouldn't be interested in something that they had to prepare, invest in, worry about, etc. I'm gonna rewrite my rules blurb later today when I have time.

 

[john112364]

Well if you want to do away with the slots how about this as a modification:

This is an add-on to the standard ritual casting rules. No additional feat is required.

Combat Ritual Casting: You can cast rituals in combat. You may use Combat Ritual Casting two times per day at 1st level, three times at 11th, and 4 times at 21st. Combat Ritual Casting is refreshed after an extended rest.

Cast a ritual in combat: You can begin casting ritual as a standard action. Casting time is an additional standard action per ten full minutes of non-combat casting time (i.e a ten minute ritual takes two rounds to cast, a 1 hour ritual takes 7 rounds to cast) . You may sustain a ritual you are casting as a minor action so that you may take other actions. If you sustain you do not loose the ritual, it is merely suspended in mid-casting. If you are stunned, or unconscious, or you do not sustain a ritual on a given turn, you must begin again. Rituals which require special preparation (eg. a circle of silver dust on the ground, special symbols drawn on a subject) are still subject to those requirements. The dungeon master has the final word on which rituals may be used in combat.

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I think this distills eriktheguy's original system while eliminating the need for slots, charges, etc. I think this would make a very appealling add-on with out a lot of extra bookkeeping.
And just so non-combat cast rituals don't get left out in the cold, what do you think about making non-combat rituals cost, say,10% less. This way casters would still have incentives to use rituals other than in combat.

 

[eriktheguy]

Well if you want to do away with the slots how about this as a modification:

This is an add-on to the standard ritual casting rules. No additional feat is required.

Combat Ritual Casting: You can cast rituals in combat. You may use Combat Ritual Casting two times per day at 1st level, three times at 11th, and 4 times at 21st. Combat Ritual Casting is refreshed after an extended rest.

Cast a ritual in combat: You can begin casting ritual as a standard action. Casting time is an additional standard action per ten full minutes of non-combat casting time (i.e a ten minute ritual takes two rounds to cast, a 1 hour ritual takes 7 rounds to cast) . You may sustain a ritual you are casting as a minor action so that you may take other actions. If you sustain you do not loose the ritual, it is merely suspended in mid-casting. If you are stunned, or unconscious, or you do not sustain a ritual on a given turn, you must begin again. Rituals which require special preparation (eg. a circle of silver dust on the ground, special symbols drawn on a subject) are still subject to those requirements. The dungeon master has the final word on which rituals may be used in combat.

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I think this distills eriktheguy's original system while eliminating the need for slots, charges, etc. I think this would make a very appealling add-on with out a lot of extra bookkeeping.
And just so non-combat cast rituals don't get left out in the cold, what do you think about making non-combat rituals cost, say,10% less. This way casters would still have incentives to use rituals other than in combat.

Yeah, thats even simpler and eliminates the need for slots and some bookkeeping. I've made a few recommended clarifications above.
I don't see how this leaves non-combat rituals in the cold. Players can only use combat rituals in combat, and cannot do so simply by declaring combat on a tree etc (bag of rats rule). Many people think that rituals already take too long and cost too much though, so give them a discount if you like. Would 50% even be game breaking?
Obviously none of these discounts apply to item creation.

 

[Nytmare]

Does any of this threaten to tread on the toes of the "we don't want wizards (or ritual casters) to be better than class X at things that class X is supposed to best at?"

The "wizard as Batman" thing is something I don't really miss from the good old days.

 

[john112364]

Yeah, thats even simpler and eliminates the need for slots and some bookkeeping. I've made a few recommended clarifications above.
I don't see how this leaves non-combat rituals in the cold. Players can only use combat rituals in combat, and cannot do so simply by declaring combat on a tree etc (bag of rats rule). Many people think that rituals already take too long and cost too much though, so give them a discount if you like. Would 50% even be game breaking?
Obviously none of these discounts apply to item creation.

Oops. I actually meant to include those in the original draft. Good catch.

 

[john112364]

Does any of this threaten to tread on the toes of the "we don't want wizards (or ritual casters) to be better than class X at things that class X is supposed to best at?"

The "wizard as Batman" thing is something I don't really miss from the good old days.

Not really. especially since anyone can get a feat for ritual casting and it seems like 1/3 (at least) of the classes start with it for free.

I have a really cool idea for a ritual using rouge that I'm going to use one day.

 

[RyvenCedrylle]

The way I have this houseruled is as follows - and is similar to Erik's:

"Any character who is capable of performing rituals may prepare rituals during an extended rest to be completed as a standard action, much in the way magic worked in previous versions of D&D. The character must pay the component cost up front and be able to meet all other requirements of the ritual during the rest period in order to prepare it. This means that, for instance, Imprisonment would be impossible to prepare since the subject of the ritual must be present for the entire casting. If a ritual is not used by the next extended rest, it is lost."

So Magic Circle would only work in combat if you could lure a known subject into the pre-drawn circle (at which point I think you deserve it) or if something of the proper type just happened to wander into the right spot without breaking the circle.

 

[eriktheguy]

Does any of this threaten to tread on the toes of the "we don't want wizards (or ritual casters) to be better than class X at things that class X is supposed to best at?"

The "wizard as Batman" thing is something I don't really miss from the good old days.

No, since multiple classes can use it, and it can take several rounds to do (most combats in a batman movie would be over by then). Also wizards could use a decent buff, but that's an argument for another thread.

The way I have this houseruled is as follows - and is similar to Erik's:

"Any character who is capable of performing rituals may prepare rituals during an extended rest to be completed as a standard action, much in the way magic worked in previous versions of D&D. The character must pay the component cost up front and be able to meet all other requirements of the ritual during the rest period in order to prepare it. This means that, for instance, Imprisonment would be impossible to prepare since the subject of the ritual must be present for the entire casting. If a ritual is not used by the next extended rest, it is lost."

So Magic Circle would only work in combat if you could lure a known subject into the pre-drawn circle (at which point I think you deserve it) or if something of the proper type just happened to wander into the right spot without breaking the circle.

Yeah, always like to have that clause there at the end, since the most powerful rituals are often difficult to perform.

 

[Dragonblade]

I'm seeing a lot of creative ritual casting rules. I think some of these rules would be perfect for some people's games.

But for me personally, any rules I use for casting rituals in combat must meet the following requirements:

1) There should not be any slots or any daily limits imposed on what you can cast beyond the component cost itself.

2) There should be no requirement for pre-selecting or pre-casting rituals prior to combat.

3) No components should be expended unless the ritual is successfully performed (which is the rule per the PHB).

Those design tenets were what really drove the rules I created and posted (back on page 1 for those of you jumping into the thread for the first time.) My vision was that casting rituals in combat should act almost like a mini-skill challenge for the caster and those aiding him or her.

 

[Piratecat]

I'm seeing a lot of creative ritual casting rules. I think some of these rules would be perfect for some people's games.

But for me personally, any rules I use for casting rituals in combat must meet the following requirements:

I've just instituted a house rule changing casting time from minutes into rounds. I'll be curious if it makes a difference in how often rituals get used.