Smite and Cleave

[Malin Genie]

A Paldin uses a smite attack against an evil creature and drops said evil creature, triggering Cleave. If the victim of the Cleave is also evil, do the smite bonuses apply?

 

[dvvega]

No since smite is valid for a single attack only, and announced before said attack.

You don't get smite on all your attacks in a Full Attack so why would you on cleave - it's not the same attack, it's a bonus attack.

the character gets an immediate, extra melee attack

 

[Crothian]

But the problem is the cleave attack is at the same bonuses as the original attack. I would say that smite does not apply for the cleave attack, but according to wording:

"The extra attack is with the same weapon and at the same bonus as the attack that dropped the previous creature."

it could be argued that it does apply. I might compromise that the attack bonus stays, but the damage bonus no longer applies. Where's Caliban when you need him??

 

[Alaric_Prympax]

But the problem is the cleave attack is at the same bonuses as the original attack. I would say that smite does not apply for the cleave attack, but according to wording:

"The extra attack is with the same weapon and at the same bonus as the attack that dropped the previous creature."

it could be argued that it does apply. I might compromise that the attack bonus stays, but the damage bonus no longer applies. Where's Caliban when you need him??

The 'at the same bonus' I would say would mean BAB, Str, and Magical Weapon bonus. I don't think the Smite bonus, which is a special ability of a class, would be included on the 'Cleave' attack. In other words the 'Cleave' would include any bonuses you would have in your 'normal' regular attack with that weapon.

All of this is of course is IMO.

 

[CRGreathouse]

I wouldn't let it carry over, and I don't know anyone who would let it carry over.

 

[Caliban]

Bonuses like Smite or True strike would not carry over to the extra attack from a cleave (because they very specifically apply to only a single attack roll).

From the context, the Cleave feat seems to be referring to the BAB when it says the extra attack is made at the same bonus as the originating attack.

 

[Cyraneth]

Even though people seem to agree on this post/question, I'm going to post a question that popped into my mind when I read this, and I think I know the answer already, but still. So this is just to be sure:

Does the bonus from smite or true strike apply to the critical confirmation roll, then? I know, it is the same attack, but it's another roll. One could argue that a cleave would be the same attack as well, e.i. cleaving through one opponent to hit the next with the same swing.

Anyways, just to have things clarified.

- Cyraneth

 

[Crothian]

For a confirmed critical roll, the bonuses for smite and true strike do apply. That I know for certain. Unless Caliban comes by and tells me I'm wrong, then I'm just going to curl up into a little ball.

 

[Caliban]

For a confirmed critical roll, the bonuses for smite and true strike do apply. That I know for certain. Unless Caliban comes by and tells me I'm wrong, then I'm just going to curl up into a little ball.

You are correct. The critical confirmation roll is considered part of the attack roll.

 

[SpikeyFreak]

Don't you like contradiction!?

Cleave:
The extra attack is with the same weapon and at the same bonus

Smite:
Once per day, a paladin of 2nd level or higher may attempt to smite evil with one normal melee attack.

I would say that you don't get the bonus because it says one NORMAL attack, and I don't think cleave is a normal attack. It is very contradictory though.

--

Spikey