D&D 5E So...warlocks?

[trentonjoe]

I think the Warlock can definitely be a "striker". They can do some serious melee damage with the blade pact or can be a ranged artillery guy with their EB if you choose the augmenting incantations.

My first level guy does 1d10+1d6 (hex spell)+3 with 14 AC and 11 HP (with temp HP starting at 2nd level). I fully plan on him being a front line fighter.

I think you can go roguey/scouty with the familiar pact as well. Like most classes, it is super versatile, you can more or less choose whatever role you want.

 

[77IM]

Personally, I'm trying to figure out what the warlock's "role" in the party is. They're spell list is kind of wonky, IMO, and they lack a lot of the fun spells other arcane casters get (teleporting and the like).

My feelings exactly. Of all the classes, it is least clear what the heck the warlock is supposed to do.

I wish they had made eldritch blast a class feature instead of a spell, like in the original 3e conception of the class. This would have sent a clear message to new players: "OK, so I'm going to go around zapping people with this blast thingy, plus I've got some cool spells on the side. Neat." It could be the simple caster you hand to newbies (its original intent).

Instead, by making eldritch blast just another cantrip and burying most of the class features in invocations, they've created a very flexible but complicated class that I'm not sure what to do with. It's a kind of a mess.

 

[yakuba]

I really like them so far. Their are very diverse in terms of roles. I think warlocks will usually be Cha/Dex the (IMO) best Interaction/Exploration stats. There's a natural strength in the utility roles which can be further buttressed via Invocations choices or Chain and Tome packs. Still the warlock is also really strong combat artillery.

In my game this week we're going to have a Tome Starlock and a Pact Weapon Feylock, and I anticipate that they are going to be really different, whereas we have had a Thief and an Assassin, as well as a Battlemaster and a Vengeance paladin and those pairs of characters played really similarly to each other.

Taking a number of 4e spells, I think helped a lot; those spells definitely bring a distinct feel to the some of the magic that warlocks cast.

 

[Werebat]

Instead, by making eldritch blast a cantrip and burying most of the class features in invocations, they've created a very flexible but complicated class that I'm not sue what to do with. It's a kind of a mess.

Wait -- there are players who DON'T consult the optimization boards before making a character?

 

[yakuba]

My feelings exactly. Of all the classes, it is least clear what the heck the warlock is supposed to do.

I think it's fairly clear that the warlock is an in combat damage dealer, and a utility/face character outside of combat. There's just a LOT of flexibility in how you can approach it.

I wish they had made eldritch blast a class feature instead of a spell, like in the original 3e conception of the class. This would have sent a clear message to new players: "OK, so I'm going to go around zapping people with this blast thingy, plus I've got some cool spells on the side. Neat." It could be the simple caster you hand to newbies (its original intent).

Instead, by making eldritch blast just another cantrip and burying most of the class features in invocations, they've created a very flexible but complicated class that I'm not sure what to do with. It's a kind of a mess.

I'd agree if there were other apparent choices, but since eldritch blast is the ONLY attack cantrip in the Warlock list, I think it's really hard to miss. There's no similar note for any of the other casters that calls out that one should take at least one attack cantrip.

 

[Andor]

I'd agree if there were other apparent choices, but since eldritch blast is the ONLY attack cantrip in the Warlock list, I think it's really hard to miss. There's no similar note for any of the other casters that calls out that one should take at least one attack cantrip.

They also get chill touch and poison spray. They're all roughly equal in power. There's actually no reason to take Eldritch blast if you're not planning to stack invocations on top of it.

 

[yakuba]

They also get chill touch and poison spray. They're all roughly equal in power. There's actually no reason to take Eldritch blast if you're not planning to stack invocations on top of it.

Wow! My bad, and I actually (called myself) checking the PHB before I posted that. Apologies to 771M.

 

[ppaladin123]

So now that the PH has been out for close to a week, I'd like to open the thread up to general warlock discussion. Whatt do people think now that we can see all that they can do (and can't do).

Personally, I'm trying to figure out what the warlock's "role" in the party is. They're spell list is kind of wonky, IMO, and they lack a lot of the fun spells other arcane casters get (teleporting and the like).

They do get misty step, which is a 30 ft teleport but you probably don't want to use it if you can help it because....

Until level 11 you are limited to two spell slots between rests. That is a fairly serious restriction. On the other hand the slots gain in power such that they are eventually 5th level. It seems like you'd want to focus on spells that improve/grow stronger when cast at higher levels and on long-duration buffs/debuffs/area spells to really get the most out of this. For example: Hex, Fly, Spider Climb, Evard's Black Tentacles (if Great Old One).

The Patrons offer a few nice spells but the abilities they offer are mostly defensive until the capstone.

The invocations are mostly damage and scouting/utility oriented. The Pact of Chain and Pact of the Blade Warlock could be excellent scouts/infiltrators. In battle they'd mostly rely on eldritch blast (or the the blade with thirsting blade and lifedrinker), with the spell slots used for "oh crap" moments or the occasional well-timed/well-placed megaspell.

The Pact of the Tome seems like he is meant to be a utility caster outside of battle and a Eldritch Blaster/occasional debuffer inside of battle. You can collect rituals from every class and use invocations to further this.

So you might get:

Invocations:

speak with animals at will
detect magic at will
"read all writing"
speak with dead at will
arcane eye at will
witch sight: see true forms of creatures/through illusions

and spells:
comprehend languages
identify
unseen servant
water walk
tenser's floating disk
etc.

This might be helpful if you don't have a wizard in your party and you need some out of combat magic support.

Still, I think the warlock is a bit of an odd bird; if the bard or monk were the classic "5th man" in 3e, I think the warlock fills that role here.

 

[grimslade]

Warlock- Spellcasting Versatility

I love the class. It is marvelously versatile focused spell caster. You can also grab a wonderful array of skills to go with invocations.

I am torn between running a Mountain dwarf blade pact fiendlock for a front line tanky supernatural menace. If your game includes multi-classing grab some levels of paladin oath of vengeance for some smiting with your hexing.

Or a GOO pact half-elf bladelock going twf and focusing dex for multiple attacking hexing goodness. Again, if multi-classing is an option add in some monk to add discipline to your madness and also some flurry of blows to get more hex damage.

Or go full on Eldritch spellslinger and grab Pact of the Chain for a deluxe familiar to help with targets and grab all the eldritch blast invocations.

Eldritch blast is perfect as a cantrip. It fits. Now Hex, should be a class feature. It is necessary to every Warlock build for damage output.

 

[gyor]

The cool thing about the Tomelock is she can get a taste of the other two boons, abit not as good. She can get the find familiar ritual, and the Shillalah (sorry misspelled that) cantrip. Personally the cantrips I'd take if I was a Tomelock is Shillalah, Guidance, and Produce Flame, and from the Warlock itself, I'd take Eldrich Blast and Minor Illusion.

First 2 invocations would be Agonizing Blast and Tomelocks ritual caster invocation, with familiar and unseen servant as my first two rituals.

.As a Chainlock you don't really have decide which type of familiar because with the find familiar ritual you can change it into any form you need. For Cantrips I'd start off with Chill Touch and Eldrich Blast.

I'd want Shocking Grasp eventually probably via feat. Honestly aside from the one invocation, Warlock doesn't offer much that dovetails with your familiar until True Polymorph, so I'd concider MCing into Paladin for protective aura abilities and damage buffs like Crusader's Mantle, Battlemaster for the more Warlord Manuvuers, Trickery Cleric to buff your familiar's Stealth, or Conjurer Wizard so that when you get high enough in level everytime you summon your familiar it gets 30 temo
p hp. Personally I'd go with Battlemaster Fighter. Say you have your Familiar in Sprite Form (for the poison range attack), and your high enough to have 3 attacks. You take the first one and use a manvuer to give your Sprite more accuracy on it next attack, you give your next attack to your sprite which it strikes with more accuracy and poisons an enemy, next you use Commander's Strike to grant your Sprite Another Attack, an attack that deals your die extra damage.

A Bladelock I'd either focus a big two handed weapon or make a magic weapon like the Staff of Fire my pact weapon, using both its innate magical abilities, the fact that its a staff an arcane focus, and the Polemaster feat in the case of the Staff of Fire. Also by raw I think I could make the staff of fire take any weapon form I chose once it became my pact weapon.