D&D General Spear: d8; versatile d10, and when used two-handed, can be lunged one-handed (d8) with reach.

[greg kaye]

My point is a sword is better on average att all of those that a spear.

I'm yet to see your conjecture tested. Even with sword-trained, hema participants, spears generally proved to perform better.
We don't want theory, we want "science" and, so far, the evidence, even with reference to it's nearest competitors, favours spears.

 

[ad_hoc]

The 2024 D&D seems to have a good idea about weapons.

Let martial characters have special properties on them. Great balancing to let other characters use the weapons too.

 

[Minigiant]

I'm yet to see your conjecture tested. Even with sword-trained, hema participants, spears generally proved to perform better.
We don't want theory, we want "science" and, so far, the evidence, even with reference to it's nearest competitors, favours spears.

Your scientist stated my point.

"If you were on your own with spear and shield vs someone with sword and shield, you were dead.

However when we were fighting we just didn't have a spear, we had a sword daggling from our waist. So when we realized 'oh he's got me,' we could just drop the spear and draw a sword."

 

[greg kaye]

Your scientist stated my point.

"If you were on your own with spear and shield vs someone with sword and shield, you were dead.

However when we were fighting we just didn't have a spear, we had a sword daggling from our waist. So when we realized 'oh he's got me,' we could just drop the spear and draw a sword."

I gladly accept that the sword and shield is a very underpowered combination in 5e. (I've used it but haven't seen it widely used elsewhere).
In this case though, the spear wielder might do better to drop the shield and gain better control and reach with their weapon.

 

[greg kaye]

With thanks for all the valuable comments, I've just added a take three to the OP:

Spear (when used with Martial training): two-handed, d10 piercing or d6 bludgeoning, or, one-handed (though still with two hands remaining available for spear use), d8 piercing with reach?

 

[aco175]

However when we were fighting we just didn't have a spear, we had a sword daggling from our waist. So when we realized 'oh he's got me,' we could just drop the spear and draw a sword."

I forgot if we can drop the spear as a free action and then draw the sword as part of the same action, or as part of the next attack?

 

[greg kaye]

I forgot if we can drop the spear as a free action and then draw the sword as part of the same action, or as part of the next attack?

That's perfect for a 5e mechanic and a typical player economy.

... In the real world, daggers could also deal as fatal blows as any weapon to anyone. They were often the weapon of choice once into close combat. Shortswords also have the 5e advantage of finesse. I'm sure that the well-placed hits that we call criticals may have advantaged smaller and finesse-enabled weapons.

Long or short-handed picks and warhammers were notable in the takeover from both spears and (whether great or not) swords when armour became more involved. Armour is a tricky issue but, again, daggers could be great.

 

[bedir than]

If the goal is to make the spear more desirable adding on these layers of mechanics would do the opposite at my table.

The players I've experienced aren't looking for several options from the same weapon. Make the spear simply, and better. Not complicated and a single point better once in awhile

 

[greg kaye]

If the goal is to make the spear more desirable adding on these layers of mechanics would do the opposite at my table.

The players I've experienced aren't looking for several options from the same weapon. Make the spear simply, and better. Not complicated and a single point better once in awhile

Swords, I'd have thought, were the most intuitive (and simple) of weapons to initially get to grips with. A sword is balanced and natural and better suited for someone to defend themselves than a dagger or hand axe, mace or (at a greater extreme) sickle. I mean, which weapon would you find more simple so as to gain an initial proficient level of use. Many simple weapons might be better named ~bad weapons.

I'd be as happy with removing spears from the simple weapons category as I would be in adding weapons like short swords into the simple weapons category.

To make things simple I'd be ok with just giving the reach property to spears.

Another solution I'd considered is to house rule all swingable weapons as giving +1 to AC and applying this to, essentially, all one and two-handed weapons other than the one-handed spear and the whip. (I'd also be open to a held arcane focus such as a rod or a staff as providing +1 AC.

In this case, it would be easier to apply to the spear a more straightforward d8 and versatile d10 as there would be an (AC-based) accounting for the sword and shield being better, on a one-against-one basis, than the spear and shield.