Star Wars Spoilers Thread [Spoilers]

So here's my review: 100% a Star Wars film which belongs with the original trilogy.

It's a transitional film, but it does it well. The new generation is really good.

I think the major death was kinda signposted a bit. You knew it was coming long before it happened. I felt worse for Chewie, but he, Rey, and BB8 make a great team.

Is this the first Star Wars film where nobody gets their hand cut off?

Luke lives in Ireland, eh?

Question: WHY was there a map to Luke, and why was it split into two? I feel like I missed something. For that matter, why a map and not just some coordinates? Seems like a random puzzle set up for the sake of it.

 

[Morrus]

This, all of it.
Also they might just leave romance out of it entirely, three friends that need no romantic entanglements, more familial love than romantic love.

I would like that. Obligatory romances are kinda tiresome to me. I like to see other forms of relationship addressed in stuff. They do a lot with parent/child in Star Wars, and the themes of friendship and loyalty (and betrayal) are strong.

 

[MechaPilot]

I just saw the film last night. I have to say that it was a fun film to watch, but it definitely didn't live up to the hype: it's Star Wars, it literally couldn't live up to the hype even if it was 100% as good as the original films.



Although I found the film enjoyable (the thumbs-up/lighter moment between Fin and BB8 was absolutely precious), I do have some issues with the movie.

The big Han death scene was just bad. I like the Han character. I even like Kylo Ren. However, this film gave us absolutely nothing about the relationship between Han and Ren. When Ren then betrays that relationship, it's a great moment that falls flat because they didn't put the work in to make me care about their relationship.


Another major issue that I had was that the film was fairly unoriginal. It parallels and copies the original trilogy so hard that I felt like I was watching a mashup of episodes 4, 5 and 6:

1) We have an important piece of intel being placed in a droid.
2) We have a young person gifted with the force living on a desert planet.
3) We have that person meeting the droid who didn't make it straight back to the rebels.
4) We have that young person's life being completely uprooted and thrown into disarray because of her association with the droid carrying the intel.
5) We have a masked dark jedi working for the empire.
6) That dark jedi was trained by a good jedi and was then seduced to evil by a dark master.
7) The dark jedi has two relatives, one of which tells the other that there is still good in the dark jedi.
8) The dark jedi has a master that we only see in holographic communications.
9) There is conflict between the dark jedi and the non-jedi imperial officers, who live under the threat of that dark jedi's wrath.
10) The force-gifted young person meets a father like mentor who agrees to help with the droid issue.
11) We have a wizened old person giving a lightsaber to the force-gifted young person.
12) We have the young person rejecting the heroes call at first and then taking it up when a person she cares about is hurt.
13) We have a massive weapon capable of killing planets.
14) We have a mission to knock out a force field generator.
15) We have a bombing run on the one vulnerable spot on the planet-killing weapon.
16) We have C3PO interjecting himself into a romantic moment between Han and Leia: to quote Cinemasins, "The 'C' stand for cock-block."
17) We have a force-gifted young person going off on her own to train with a jedi master in exile.
18) We have the heroes hiding under the deck-plates when the falcon is swallowed up by a larger ship.
19) We have the he's my relative revelation about the one of the heroes and the dark jedi.
20) We have the death of the father-like mentor to the force-gifted young person, which eventually spurs the seeking of a new mentor (see #17).


Also, if you suck up a sun to use as a weapon to destroy planets, when that weapon is destroyed the sun is not going to simply reconstitute itself.

 

[Orlax]

I just saw the film last night. I have to say that it was a fun film to watch, but it definitely didn't live up to the hype: it's Star Wars, it literally couldn't live up to the hype even if it was 100% as good as the original films.



Although I found the film enjoyable (the thumbs-up/lighter moment between Fin and BB8 was absolutely precious), I do have some issues with the movie.

The big Han death scene was just bad. I like the Han character. I even like Kylo Ren. However, this film gave us absolutely nothing about the relationship between Han and Ren. When Ren then betrays that relationship, it's a great moment that falls flat because they didn't put the work in to make me care about their relationship.


Another major issue that I had was that the film was fairly unoriginal. It parallels and copies the original trilogy so hard that I felt like I was watching a mashup of episodes 4, 5 and 6:

1) We have an important piece of intel being placed in a droid.
2) We have a young person gifted with the force living on a desert planet.
3) We have that person meeting the droid who didn't make it straight back to the rebels.
4) We have that young person's life being completely uprooted and thrown into disarray because of her association with the droid carrying the intel.
5) We have a masked dark jedi working for the empire.
6) That dark jedi was trained by a good jedi and was then seduced to evil by a dark master.
7) The dark jedi has two relatives, one of which tells the other that there is still good in the dark jedi.
8) The dark jedi has a master that we only see in holographic communications.
9) There is conflict between the dark jedi and the non-jedi imperial officers, who live under the threat of that dark jedi's wrath.
10) The force-gifted young person meets a father like mentor who agrees to help with the droid issue.
11) We have a wizened old person giving a lightsaber to the force-gifted young person.
12) We have the young person rejecting the heroes call at first and then taking it up when a person she cares about is hurt.
13) We have a massive weapon capable of killing planets.
14) We have a mission to knock out a force field generator.
15) We have a bombing run on the one vulnerable spot on the planet-killing weapon.
16) We have C3PO interjecting himself into a romantic moment between Han and Leia: to quote Cinemasins, "The 'C' stand for cock-block."
17) We have a force-gifted young person going off on her own to train with a jedi master in exile.
18) We have the heroes hiding under the deck-plates when the falcon is swallowed up by a larger ship.
19) We have the he's my relative revelation about the one of the heroes and the dark jedi.
20) We have the death of the father-like mentor to the force-gifted young person, which eventually spurs the seeking of a new mentor (see #17).


Also, if you suck up a sun to use as a weapon to destroy planets, when that weapon is destroyed the sun is not going to simply reconstitute itself.

Bond between parent and child, no need for any kind of setup. Most especially between a parent and a child believed lost forever (trust me that gets messy). The face touch at the end is really all you need to get the weight of the scene.

The parallels are there purposefully. One of the major things jj identified on his way in is that there was always something distinctly Star Wars missing about the PT. So he took a hard look at the OT to develop his trilogy. He hit alot of the same beats but the song and themes are very different here. To me that's actually a fairly awesome part of the movie. It's so identifiably Star Wars, most especially hitting the beat of the dead master in the first of the trilogy (though you've misidentified who the master was teaching, the force user didn't need the basics, the old master was teaching Fin). Yet at that same time it is definitely still telling it's own story with those similar story beats. I understand why some might not have liked it the most, but I absolutely loved the level of homage. I will say I hope it doesn't continue entirely through the ST.

 

[Orlax]

Also quick aside, had anyone yet mentioned the hilarity of the fact that it's essentially an OT Fangirl vs a PT Fanboy.

 

[MarkB]

This, all of it.

Also they might just leave romance out of it entirely, three friends that need no romantic entanglements, more familial love than romantic love.

I figure they're just playing it safe in this movie, in case they decide to make some or all of the protagonists siblings a couple of sequels down the line.

 

[Morrus]

Another major issue that I had was that the film was fairly unoriginal. It parallels and copies the original trilogy so hard that I felt like I was watching a mashup of episodes 4, 5 and 6:

Whether one likes that or not, it's a deliberate feature, not a bug. The movie serves as a regrounding.

 

[MechaPilot]

Bond between parent and child, no need for any kind of setup. Most especially between a parent and a child believed lost forever (trust me that gets messy). The face touch at the end is really all you need to get the weight of the scene.

I get the parent and child thing. I do. But, for me it needs more. The face touch was helpful to the mood of the scene, but it was just incapable of lifting the weight they were placing on it. They either needed a little more dialogue between them before the slaying, or they needed to linger longer on the intimacy of the consequences before Han fell off the walkway. Now, maybe some fans are projecting the emotion from Han's more fleshed-out relationship with his son in the books onto the film, or projecting from their own relationships onto the film, but I am rather unbiased on this because I am not a parent, and I have not read any of the books where Han has a son. Being unbiased, I just felt that the scene as it was shown fell flat because they didn't make me care about the relationship.

The parallels are there purposefully. One of the major things jj identified on his way in is that there was always something distinctly Star Wars missing about the PT. So he took a hard look at the OT to develop his trilogy. He hit alot of the same beats but the song and themes are very different here. To me that's actually a fairly awesome part of the movie. It's so identifiably Star Wars, most especially hitting the beat of the dead master in the first of the trilogy (though you've misidentified who the master was teaching, the force user didn't need the basics, the old master was teaching Fin). Yet at that same time it is definitely still telling it's own story with those similar story beats. I understand why some might not have liked it the most, but I absolutely loved the level of homage. I will say I hope it doesn't continue entirely through the ST.

For me, the parallels were too many. I agree that the film was identfiably Star Wars, even if it felt like they dropped the ball a bit on maintaining the depth of the fantasy feeling that the original trilogy had.

 

[MechaPilot]

Whether one likes that or not, it's a deliberate feature, not a bug. The movie serves as a regrounding.

It's not that I have an issue with some parallels to tie the new film to the original trilogy, but I listed 20 of them and I'm sure I probably missed a couple. I think they could have done just as well with fewer parallels. If nothing else, they could have ditched the whole "let's just make an even bigger planet-killing moon/planet like weapon/base and recycle the destruction of the already recycled death star."

 

[Morrus]

Now, maybe some fans are projecting the emotion from Han's more fleshed-out relationship with his son in the books onto the film, or projecting from their own relationships onto the film, but I am rather unbiased on this because I am not a parent, and I have not read any of the books where Han has a son. Being unbiased, I just felt that the scene as it was shown fell flat because they didn't make me care about the relationship.

Your special "unbiased" status is not unique, or even rare. I am not a parent, nor have I read the books. My feelings about the scene are very different to yours though.

 

[MechaPilot]

Your special "unbiased" status is not unique, or even rare. I am not a parent, nor have I read the books. My feelings about the scene are very different to yours though.

I didn't say that my status was "special." I was merely pointing out that Star Was has a significant portion of their fanbase who either are parents or have read the extended universe materials (or both). All film is subjective, and other people who share my unbiased condition may very well view things differently than I do. However, for me, the film committed the cardinal story-telling sin of making a major point of the film hinge on something that they didn't make me care about.

Edit: believe me, with the number of times I've seriously contemplated suicide I absolutely know there's nothing special about me. Maybe the exact combination of traits and quirks is semi-unique, but every part of who I am is utterly replaceable.