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Supernatural Season 4 - Spoilers

phoenixgod2000

First Post
What makes you think that?

New Ruby seemed awfuly unsure of herself and almost came across to me as strangely dependant on Sam. Plus she had that line about how she didn't want to come between Sam and his brother. The whole diner scene between them played in a really weird way with Ruby as the weaker partner. It just struck me that Ruby was unsure of herself because she was mortal now and had lost all her demonic confidence. Sam was the strong one now, not her.

<Shrug> Or it could be just a bad actress making weird acting decisions for her character.
 

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Mark Chance

Boingy! Boingy!
Here's my two-cents worth:

First, the season opener was good, but I think a bit predictable, which leads me to believe that we can take very little of it at face value.

Second, the writers have paid attention to mainstream Christian theology in the past. For example, the episode in which a murdered priest "came back" as an avenging "angel". When he was summoned and confronted by another priest he'd known in life, the priest pointed out that humans don't become angels when they die. The "angel" priest remembered this, and then turned to light and "passed on to the other side".

Third, if the writers continue this attention to detail, then Ruby's claim that humans in Hell become demons is also false. Within traditional Christian belief, the demons are fallen angels, not the souls of the damned.

Put all of this together, and Dean's angel could indeed be an angel, and a very fallen one at that. If this is the case, very nearly everything he told Dean was a lie. After all, if there really is a war in Hell going on, then certainly the BBEGs of Hell are involved. My bet is that the angel is really a Lord of Hell, the one who actually holds the contract for Dean's soul. Lilith proved powerless to destroy Sam, so now it's time to up the ante by using Dean against his brother and Sam's newfound ability to exorcise demons with a gesture.

Of course, this is all speculation, and is certainly not intended to start any sort of theological dispute.
 


Arnwyn

First Post
Thought it was quite good and enjoyed myself.

Nice to (finally) see "the other side" (and hopefully the other side really is the other side). *ahem*
 

Umbran

Mod Squad
Staff member
Supporter
New Ruby seemed awfuly unsure of herself and almost came across to me as strangely dependant on Sam.
...
Sam was the strong one now, not her.

Um, you did see what Sam did to the other demon there, right? It sure looks like Sam is now capable of either destroying demons, or sending them back to Hell, no ritual required. Presumably, this power was dangerous to Lilith, who seemed to be more powerful than Ruby.

It seems to me that she is the weaker partner, and is smart enough to not risk cheesing Sam off. She's awoken a dragon, and is stepping around it gingerly - that's only reasonable. No need to call on mortality - just good sense.
 

I don't know how all y'all are making these conclusions about Ruby. She had... what? Four? Five? lines of dialogue total in this episode.

As far as I'm concerned we don't yet know anything about Ruby's new body, if she's come back as a kinder, gentler Ruby, if she's scared of Sam, or if everything's exactly the same as it used to be.

I agree that the actor who played Castiel was really good, even with just a few lines of dialogue.

The idea that he really is this angel, and that he's so powerful that all the demons are just freakin' out like that one "game over, man!" demon that Sam sent back to Hell... that would be a really boring season. "Yeah, we're going to quit hunting because now this angel is so much better at it than us. Let's hit the beach in Cancun and snag some girls gone wild!" So, I'm with the bouncy Pac-Man avatar guy that chances are we can't yet trust anything that we "know" based on this episode.

Although, possibly Sam and Dean make Girls Gone Wild wouldn't be such a bad thing after all.

"You are not invited!"
 

D.Shaffer

First Post
The idea that he really is this angel, and that he's so powerful that all the demons are just freakin' out like that one "game over, man!" demon that Sam sent back to Hell... that would be a really boring season.
Well, if even if he IS telling the truth about his intentions, it all depends on the actual outcome they're shooting for. Not all angels are the new age 'White wings and feel good' type angels we're used to these days. Angels can be rather horrific in appearance when you get right down to it(wheels of fire with multiple eyes anyone?) and angels can be a SERIOUS sign of some nasty stuff about to come down the pipe.
 

Brown Jenkin

First Post
I don't know how all y'all are making these conclusions about Ruby. She had... what? Four? Five? lines of dialogue total in this episode.

As far as I'm concerned we don't yet know anything about Ruby's new body, if she's come back as a kinder, gentler Ruby, if she's scared of Sam, or if everything's exactly the same as it used to be.

I agree that the actor who played Castiel was really good, even with just a few lines of dialogue.

That is part of my point on the Old Ruby/New Ruby casting. Just like you said you really liked Castiel even with only a few lines of dialogue, that was my take on Old Ruby. The charisma of Old Ruby also jumped off the screen from when she first showed up last season even without any dialogue and when we didn't even know who she was. The new Ruby should have caught my eye and made me care from the moment I saw her. Instead she was blah and every line of dialogue that came out made it worse.
 

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