Swarm Conversion for Units

[S'mon]

Here's my first stab at guidelines on converting individual low level monsters to swarm units for facing high level PCs:

Unit Swarms: Conversion
Converting Individual Soldiers to Unit Swarms.
Troop density is x2 by area, eg 8 medium-sized men fit in a 10'x10' 2 square x 2 square area.
8 man Unit (squad): Medium figure 1x1 goes to Large 2x2 (4), Large 2x2 goes to Gargantuan 4x4 (16), Huge 3x3 (9) goes to Gargantuan 6x6 (36).
16 man Unit (squad): Medium figure 1x1 goes to Huge 3x3 (9 squares), Large 2x2 (4) goes to Gargantuan 6x6 (36)
32 man Unit (platoon): Medium figure 1x1 goes to Gargantuan 4x4 (16 squares)
64 man Unit (platoon): Medium figure 1x1 goes to Gargantuan 6x6 (36 squares)
128 man Unit (company): Medium figure 1x1 goes to Gargantuan 8x8 (64 squares)

8 man Squad: Minion converts to Swarm standard monster of 4 levels higher. Standard monster converts to Swarm elite monster 8 levels higher.
16 man squadron: Minion converts to Swarm standard monster of 8 levels higher. Standard > elite Swarm 12 levels higher.
32 man platoon: Minion converts to Swarm standard monster of 12 levels higher. Standard > elite Swarm 16 levels higher.
64 man platoon: Minion > Swarm 16 levels higher. Standard > elite Swarm 20 levels higher.
128 man Company: Minion > Swarm 20 levels higher. Standard > elite Swarm 24 levels higher.

Examples:
Savage Orc brute minion-4
In an 8 man squad they become an 8th level Swarm standard monster, size 2x2.
In a 128 man company they become a 24th level standard monster, size 8x8.

Human Town Guard soldier standard-3
In an 8 man squad they become an 11th level Swarm elite monster, size 2x2.
In a 128 man company they become a 27th level Swarm elite monster, size 8x8.

Swarm size should be tailored to PC level. Eg 27th level PCs should face a 27th level, 128 man Guards unit statted as a single swarm, whereas 23rd level PCs should face the same soldiers as 2 23rd level, 64 man platoons. 19th level PCs should face the same soldiers as 4 19th level, 32 man platoons, and 15th level PCs should face them as 8 15th level, 16 man squads. 11th level PCs could face them as 16 11th level, 8 man squads, but at that level individual guards can also threaten as 11th level minions.

 

[the Jester]

This seems to be a good approach to "epic pcs fight an army by themselves!" type gaming. I like it.

 

[S'mon]

This seems to be a good approach to "epic pcs fight an army by themselves!" type gaming. I like it.

Thanks - it's interesting that by keeping XP value (roughly) constant, and taking the normal 4e approach of keeping foe level similar to PC level, in 4e even high Epic PCs can be challenged by Army Swarms of a few hundred 'mook' opponents. In 3e Epic PCs could ignore armies, or else slaughter thousands with no danger to themselves.

 

[Oldtimer]

Have you gotten any further with this? Unless I'm missing something, there is nothing here that tells me how to stat up those swarms, right?

I would love to put my paragon PCs against hordes of orcs.

 

[ravenheart]

Oldtimer: I guess you just add the swarm keyword

Swarm
A swarm is composed of multiple creatures but functions as a single creature. A swarm can occupy the same space as another creature, and an enemy can enter a swarm’s space, which is difficult terrain. A swarm cannot be pulled, pushed, or slid by melee or ranged attacks.
A swarm can squeeze through any opening large enough for even one of its constituent creatures. For example, a swarm of bats can squeeze through an opening large enough for one of the bats to squeeze through.

and add appropriate swarm stats (resist melee/ranged, vulnerable close/area) perhaps an aura or other benefit allowing them to overrun or "surround" the PCs without taking too many OAs.

To balance this I'd add a condition upon becoming bloodied the first time , something like shrinking in size (as some units are killed or break off in panic) but with an added benefit appropriate to the role of the swarm (e.g. Brutes might get -2 AC but +1 reach and a damage boost, Soldiers might split into two smaller swarms, Skirmishers might get a mobility bonus etc).

 

[Oldtimer]

Oldtimer: I guess you just add the swarm keyword and add appropriate swarm stats (resist melee/ranged, vulnerable close/area) perhaps an aura or other benefit allowing them to overrun or "surround" the PCs without taking too many OAs.

To balance this I'd add a condition upon becoming bloodied the first time , something like shrinking in size (as some units are killed or break off in panic) but with an added benefit appropriate to the role of the swarm (e.g. Brutes might get -2 AC but +1 reach and a damage boost, Soldiers might split into two smaller swarms, Skirmishers might get a mobility bonus etc).

Sure, I understand all that. But, surely, I wouldn't keep the attack bonus, damage expression, hit points and defences of the 4th level Savage Orc Brute Minion when I compile 128 of them into a 24th level Gargantuan swarm? I was looking for a transformation formula for those things, but couldn't see one in the OP or elsewhere.

 

[ravenheart]

Sure, I understand all that. But, surely, I wouldn't keep the attack bonus, damage expression, hit points and defences of the 4th level Savage Orc Brute Minion when I compile 128 of them into a 24th level Gargantuan swarm? I was looking for a transformation formula for those things, but couldn't see one in the OP or elsewhere.

Ah, I see. Well check this out then, should be useful.

 

[Oldtimer]

Ah, I see. Well check this out then, should be useful.

Thanks, but I know those formulas too. I use them when building a monster from scratch.

Maybe I'm being dense, but if I start with the stats for a single Savage Orc Brute Minion, I would expect from the OP that I could apply something like a template to make it into a horde of orcs. Otherwise I don't understand the title of the thread.

 

[S'mon]

Thanks, but I know those formulas too. I use them when building a monster from scratch.

Maybe I'm being dense, but if I start with the stats for a single Savage Orc Brute Minion, I would expect from the OP that I could apply something like a template to make it into a horde of orcs. Otherwise I don't understand the title of the thread.

As Ravenheart says, you level it up from the base creature according to the normal rules, and give it swarm characteristics such as half damage from ranged & melee attacks. It will have aura & standard attacks based on the original creature's attack, levelled up, or the standard damage expression for the new level (I recommend elite swarms do x1.5 standard damage).

You can optionally add more special powers, but I'm not sure what you think is necessary? Swarm features are already quite a lot to deal with. If the unit is a major threat it could be statted as a Solo, in which case more exotic powers would be good - I might do that for a Roman cohort, but probably not for most units.

 

[S'mon]

Sure, I understand all that. But, surely, I wouldn't keep the attack bonus, damage expression, hit points and defences of the 4th level Savage Orc Brute Minion when I compile 128 of them into a 24th level Gargantuan swarm? I was looking for a transformation formula for those things, but couldn't see one in the OP or elsewhere.

As per RAW, attacks & defenses would be +20, as the base is a minion brute it's easiest to take damage from the standard table's High column for 24th level, although avg 40 (level+8, x 1.25), say 3d12+20 would work. Hit points will be standard for a 24th level brute, ca 265.