Tangible benefits for knowledge ranks

[Cabral]

I was thinking of granting Favored Enemies and Favored Environments as possible benefits to choose from for the various knowledge skills at every 10 ranks.

So, for example 10 ranks of:
Arcana would qualify you for Favored Enemy (Constructs, Dragons, or Magical Beasts)
Dungeoneering would qualify you for Favored Enemy (Oozes or Abberation) or Favored Terrain (Underground)
Geography would qualify you for any favored environment
etc...

In the case where multiple skills qualify you for the same benefit (Such as Knowledge-Dungeoneering and Knowledge - Geography), they do not stack and you should pick differing benefits.

At 20 ranks, and every 10 ranks thereafter, the character may choose to improve a favored enemy/environment appropriate to the skill that he already has or may choose a new favored enemy/environment.

(thus, a character with 10 ranks in Knowledge - Dugeoneering takes Favored Enemy (Abberations)+1 and also has 10 ranks in Knowledge - Geography so takes Favored Environment (Underground). If the same character later has 20 ranks in Knowledge - Dugeoneering, he can:

1. Pick up Favored Enemy Oozes 1; or
2. Improve Favored Enemy Abberations to 2; or
3. Improve Favored Environment Underground to 2.

The bonuses stack with ranger favored environment/favored enemy bonuses and can be used to qualify for feats and prestige classes.

 

[Felnar]

10 ranks seems high

here's another use for Knowledge Skills

 

[Ashardalon]

Definitely interesting. I'm not sure about the balance, but definitely interesting.

By the rules, however, this leaves a few Knowledge skills orphaned:
# Architecture and engineering (buildings, aqueducts, bridges, fortifications)
# History (royalty, wars, colonies, migrations, founding of cities)
# Nobility and royalty (lineages, heraldry, family trees, mottoes, personalities)

unless you allow Urban environment (architecture, and arguably Local), and Organizations/Groups (History and Nobility).

That said, favored enemy/terrain does not necessarily fit all types of knowledge. Contacts would be appropriate for Local and Nobility. I'm sure there are other mechanics that fit for the other skills, but I can't think of any at the moment.

 

[Cabral]

10 ranks seems high

here's another use for Knowledge Skills

I chose 10 ranks so that it's 5 ranks above synergy bonuses. I then chose to advance it every 10 ranks so that it advances slower than ranger bonuses. (in addition, the ranger abilities do not make you choose between advancing and gaining a new favored bonus.)

The idea is not to down play the Ranger abilities (which is also why I let them stack).

Definitely interesting. I'm not sure about the balance, but definitely interesting.

By the rules, however, this leaves a few Knowledge skills orphaned:
# Architecture and engineering (buildings, aqueducts, bridges, fortifications)
# History (royalty, wars, colonies, migrations, founding of cities)
# Nobility and royalty (lineages, heraldry, family trees, mottoes, personalities)

unless you allow Urban environment (architecture, and arguably Local), and Organizations/Groups (History and Nobility).

That said, favored enemy/terrain does not necessarily fit all types of knowledge. Contacts would be appropriate for Local and Nobility. I'm sure there are other mechanics that fit for the other skills, but I can't think of any at the moment.

It would definately be nice to devise something for those skills ... Urban environment is not a bad idea. Also, I don't mind Favored Enemy - Nobility. ... in this case, it's not so much an advantage for fighting them, but rather for the skill bonuses for interacting with them. (such as Knowledge Nobility giving a bonus to bluff attempts to "blend in" into noble society)

Anyway, that's why I posted here. I did the easy part, the least you can do is finish off the hard part for me.

 

[Li Shenron]

I would prefer that 10 ranks in one Knoweldge would grant a +1 synergy bonus to favored enemy bonuses (you must have favored enemies of that type).

For instance, a character with FE Dragons +4 and Demons +2, and Knowledge(Arcana) 10 could have Dragons +5, while Demons are unaffected.

I would not grant additional enemies.

 

[Cabral]

Except that doesn't benefit non-rangers. The intention is reward both the ranger with 10+ ranks in Knowledge (Nature), the Paladin with 10+ ranks in Knowledge (Planes), and the Bard with 10+ ranks in Knowledge (Dungeoneering) ...

If it is going to duplicate Favored Enemies, it has to allow you to acquire Favored Enemies in order to benefit non-rangers.
In addition, it must stack with the ranger ability in order to reward rangers equally.

The Knowledge Check rules by Amber Scott (Medesha) on the Order of the Stick site is actually, not unlike what I am proposing. The main difference I see is that initially my bonuses are smaller, but apply to several areas constantly. (Although, it could be argued that the Knowledge check mechanic can apply to any roll that the Favored Enemy version could apply to and by taking 10 on a knowledge check are equally automatic... at first) However, my version scales more slowly than hers and in fewer areas at once.

My intuitive assessment is that my Favored Enemy mechanic is less powerful than the Knowledge check system and requires fewer rolls.