Theocrat
First Post
Further Creative Marketing
Hi all -
I have many of The Le Games' products. I like some, some I don't. But really, is the company to blame for the act of creating a second account and then posting reviews of the product? No. This is a long post and I go over a few different aspects of why I believe what I believe and what I believe the community should do about it if they feel they have been wronged.
TheLe is not to blame for creating a second account to review his own product, because the internet is "anonymous" and this fortunately or unfortunately causes its own issues. As it is, I am not really Theocrat or Theocrat Issak. I have accounts for both as well as under my previous Issak the Pale. [This is because I think my Real Life name is so cool and I think that the spelling is just awesome. So I want you all to know my name, and I have always loved the Theocracy of the Pale and it's not that I'm pale skinned or that I'm even religious in real life.]
I try for Theocrat and then Theocrat Issak, but often because someone has previously used Theocrat (although I've been using it since 1998) and the name isn't available. So in this, I'm several identities. If I write a review and sign it Theocrat and then write another under Theocrat Issak, it's likely you'll know it's me. But if I do one under Theocrat and another under zombie_sniffer, you'd have no idea. And that is the way it should be - just a minor aspect of the Net Neutrality that we should all believe in.
Further, I feel that TheLe has done nothing really wrong, and this is the most important reason...a lack of purchasers writing reviews. Yes, there are people that write reviews such as Crothian, but the majority (myself included) do not write reviews of the products I download (free or paid). Thus all the TheLe games is doing is some creative marketing. If his "loyal" customers aren't writing reviews (good or bad) then we are hurting his product.
If there is a system in place (I do not know if there is or not) on RPGNow.com that says 1,450 people have bought/downloaded this product from RPGNow.com and 5,670 have downloaded from DriveThru (if connected or if this was information that was available to be passed between the two sites) and yet there were only 6 reviews, it is given that it might be a pretty decent product (just based upon the sheer number of downloads) and none of the reviews are negative.
However, from the various e-Publishing guides I've read and that are out there, if a PDF product sells 100-150 it's a success. Thus if there aren't any reviews and no way to know how many times the product has been downloaded, then the fault really lies with the customers - and the rest of the gaming community. Again, I don't know if there is a system in place that tells you how many times something has been download from RPGNow.com or DriveThru or not (and if there is, if it can combine or show you the number of downloads then that is awesome, and could help alleviate some of this issue).
But for this part of the argument, lets say that there isn't.
So with no way to know how many people have bought the product and with no reviews, some creative marketing is a must. Even if there are a few reviews in place for his own products, he has created a new account to review the product. And of course, he's going to give it a glowing review (or a 4 out of 5) because he, as TheLe2 (although, I doubt his second account would be so blatant), does believe that it's that good of a product. Thus it is a little Grey, but it is not wrong.
If there is a system in place with RPGNow.com/ DriveThru that provides a number of that site's downloads or combines it and a product has a few reviews, there likely isn't the need for the product to have these reviews. However, before the product can be downloaded by the masses, a review would have been written on the TheLe2 account. Again, I see this as more of a creative marketing ploy and nothing else.
Sony, Warner Brothers and others have been doing this for years. When you see an ad for a movie and Jacob Smithson of the Reno Journal writes a glowing review for SuperMovieAlpha and one from Mike Thompson from the LA Gazette, but you never see any from Rolling Stone, Roger Ebert, or other known names, it's because Jacob and Mike don't exist and neither do the Reno Journal or the LA Gazette. About 3 years ago, Sony got busted for this on one of their movies. Being a Journalism and Media Studies graduate with a focus on Marketing and Public Relations, I've read about and seen worse as the former Marketing Director for an elite private school here in Vegas, BABY!.
All that TheLe games has done is do some creative marketing because he felt his products warranted the time and effort of a positive review that otherwise might not have been forthcoming. And we all are contrite when we are caught. His current contriteness is a calculated risk in marketing for The Le Games. The majority of us would not recognize that his sales were unavailable for the next two weeks. Unless it was also posted what his average sales have been over the past six weeks so that we could determine that a two week suspension actually hurts because on average during a two week period he sells X number of books. If he normally sells 15 books in two weeks that could be hurtful. If he normally sells 3 books in an average two week period, it likely won't hurt. And unless it was posted on RPGNow.com and DriveThru, then none of us would be the wiser. However, by coming out and saying this is what I did, and here's how I'm overcoming any potential mistrust, he's using the negative press as another marketing aspect. So if you are going to complain about his posting of reviews under a second name, then you also need to complain that he is using his "I'm sorry" as a way to sell his products for a reduced amount. But again, I don't feel that this is wrong. Would we know that he was being punished? Not likely. Thus he is asking us to forgive him of something that others have stated are wrong (others being the community as well as the PDF sellers), but if even other publishers didn't know he was suspended prior to his post, then likely the average online consumer wouldn't know either (assuming the other publishers don't know of his suspension based upon the posts by other known PDF publishers).
So again, I do not feel that he is at fault. Both RPGNow.com and DriveThru or any other PDF seller that he may work with in addition to the gaming community is at fault. RPGNow and DriveThru should have on their payroll full time reviewers. The community does have reviewers, such as Crothian, and they are can either be paid for their time, receive the pdf/book before hand for free or they do it because it helps them in a way (by reviewing products, even if they had to pay for the product, they too benefit, because the time and effort in writing makes them a better writer, grants them more renown among the gaming community and this gives them more credibility). Even my writing this reply helps me become a better, if still prolix, writer.
The fans should write reviews, because if you liked the product enough to buy it and then thought it was useful or it was a good read but not useful or something else, then if you wrote a review of the product, TheLe Games could afford to do yet another book. So we are at fault (me too, I have most of his products and no reviews). Additionally, the PDF trading market is to blame. Each download of the PDF from the trading site is not registered on RPGNow.com or DriveThru, thus, in no way can it be known the real amount of actual downloads for any PDF book. Additionally, those that get the PDF via a trading site don't also write a review. Thus if there were/are 100 sales of a book on Paladins, and it shows this on the selling sites, with only 2 reviews (and one is suspect) the real amount of downloads can never really be known. Thus, while attempting to counter PDF trading sites is admirable to the masses, asking them to write reviews of your products in exchange for the taking of your book, might also be a recommendation. I'm not suggesting you embrace or say you will provide a PDF of your book if you write a review, but I am suggesting that you ask the PDF trading community to review your books and write a review. Especially since most PDF traders aren't going to be using their PDF trading name on the open market.
Unless everybody everywhere that has purchased (or illegally downloaded) TheLe Games books and has written a review, we are to "blame" for what he did as creative marketing. If we are to "blame," then we have no real basis for being unhappy with his ideas for creative marketing.
However, If you are unhappy with what you purchased based upon a review that he is responsible for, then by all means you should be able to ask for a refund. I believe that we should be able to ask for a refund of any product from any publisher that doesn't live up to the standards we believe it should. Yes, you now have their PDF product and could say "I deleted it" and I want my money back because it's a crappy product, but if you are going through that much trouble, it's likely that you're doing as you say.
If you feel that you bought a product based upon a review he is responsible for and feel that the product doesn't live up the hype from that review, then by all means you have the right to state how wrong you feel TheLe Games have acted and request not free products and not products at a reduced price but a full refund. Even if RPGNow.com /DriveThru won't honor a refund request, TheLe Games may, because that too would be good, positive and yet creative marketing.
Oh, and even if I already have the books that you'll be providing for free, I'll download them again, just so it up's your overall download numbers by 1. But it doesn't mean I'll write a review, thus I feel confident that other creative marketing - such as asking for it on an individual basis - may need to be looked into.
Thanks for reading my very prolix thoughts. I hope that those of you that believe he is in the wrong (and later use my post for arguments) look at what you have done for him as a person and for his company besides purchasing his products. Have you furthered his ability to write new and potentially exciting products or have you just purchased them and hoped that was enough? I'm in the latter, and is likely part of the reason I feel he didn't break any trust he had between myself and the products I've purchased.
Be Well.
Theocrat Issak
In His Path and Glory We Follow,
Theocrat Issak of the Church of the One True Path of Pholtus
GreyhawkOnline.com / ThePale.org / OerthJournal.com
Hi all -
I have many of The Le Games' products. I like some, some I don't. But really, is the company to blame for the act of creating a second account and then posting reviews of the product? No. This is a long post and I go over a few different aspects of why I believe what I believe and what I believe the community should do about it if they feel they have been wronged.
TheLe is not to blame for creating a second account to review his own product, because the internet is "anonymous" and this fortunately or unfortunately causes its own issues. As it is, I am not really Theocrat or Theocrat Issak. I have accounts for both as well as under my previous Issak the Pale. [This is because I think my Real Life name is so cool and I think that the spelling is just awesome. So I want you all to know my name, and I have always loved the Theocracy of the Pale and it's not that I'm pale skinned or that I'm even religious in real life.]
I try for Theocrat and then Theocrat Issak, but often because someone has previously used Theocrat (although I've been using it since 1998) and the name isn't available. So in this, I'm several identities. If I write a review and sign it Theocrat and then write another under Theocrat Issak, it's likely you'll know it's me. But if I do one under Theocrat and another under zombie_sniffer, you'd have no idea. And that is the way it should be - just a minor aspect of the Net Neutrality that we should all believe in.
Further, I feel that TheLe has done nothing really wrong, and this is the most important reason...a lack of purchasers writing reviews. Yes, there are people that write reviews such as Crothian, but the majority (myself included) do not write reviews of the products I download (free or paid). Thus all the TheLe games is doing is some creative marketing. If his "loyal" customers aren't writing reviews (good or bad) then we are hurting his product.
If there is a system in place (I do not know if there is or not) on RPGNow.com that says 1,450 people have bought/downloaded this product from RPGNow.com and 5,670 have downloaded from DriveThru (if connected or if this was information that was available to be passed between the two sites) and yet there were only 6 reviews, it is given that it might be a pretty decent product (just based upon the sheer number of downloads) and none of the reviews are negative.
However, from the various e-Publishing guides I've read and that are out there, if a PDF product sells 100-150 it's a success. Thus if there aren't any reviews and no way to know how many times the product has been downloaded, then the fault really lies with the customers - and the rest of the gaming community. Again, I don't know if there is a system in place that tells you how many times something has been download from RPGNow.com or DriveThru or not (and if there is, if it can combine or show you the number of downloads then that is awesome, and could help alleviate some of this issue).
But for this part of the argument, lets say that there isn't.
So with no way to know how many people have bought the product and with no reviews, some creative marketing is a must. Even if there are a few reviews in place for his own products, he has created a new account to review the product. And of course, he's going to give it a glowing review (or a 4 out of 5) because he, as TheLe2 (although, I doubt his second account would be so blatant), does believe that it's that good of a product. Thus it is a little Grey, but it is not wrong.
If there is a system in place with RPGNow.com/ DriveThru that provides a number of that site's downloads or combines it and a product has a few reviews, there likely isn't the need for the product to have these reviews. However, before the product can be downloaded by the masses, a review would have been written on the TheLe2 account. Again, I see this as more of a creative marketing ploy and nothing else.
Sony, Warner Brothers and others have been doing this for years. When you see an ad for a movie and Jacob Smithson of the Reno Journal writes a glowing review for SuperMovieAlpha and one from Mike Thompson from the LA Gazette, but you never see any from Rolling Stone, Roger Ebert, or other known names, it's because Jacob and Mike don't exist and neither do the Reno Journal or the LA Gazette. About 3 years ago, Sony got busted for this on one of their movies. Being a Journalism and Media Studies graduate with a focus on Marketing and Public Relations, I've read about and seen worse as the former Marketing Director for an elite private school here in Vegas, BABY!.
All that TheLe games has done is do some creative marketing because he felt his products warranted the time and effort of a positive review that otherwise might not have been forthcoming. And we all are contrite when we are caught. His current contriteness is a calculated risk in marketing for The Le Games. The majority of us would not recognize that his sales were unavailable for the next two weeks. Unless it was also posted what his average sales have been over the past six weeks so that we could determine that a two week suspension actually hurts because on average during a two week period he sells X number of books. If he normally sells 15 books in two weeks that could be hurtful. If he normally sells 3 books in an average two week period, it likely won't hurt. And unless it was posted on RPGNow.com and DriveThru, then none of us would be the wiser. However, by coming out and saying this is what I did, and here's how I'm overcoming any potential mistrust, he's using the negative press as another marketing aspect. So if you are going to complain about his posting of reviews under a second name, then you also need to complain that he is using his "I'm sorry" as a way to sell his products for a reduced amount. But again, I don't feel that this is wrong. Would we know that he was being punished? Not likely. Thus he is asking us to forgive him of something that others have stated are wrong (others being the community as well as the PDF sellers), but if even other publishers didn't know he was suspended prior to his post, then likely the average online consumer wouldn't know either (assuming the other publishers don't know of his suspension based upon the posts by other known PDF publishers).
So again, I do not feel that he is at fault. Both RPGNow.com and DriveThru or any other PDF seller that he may work with in addition to the gaming community is at fault. RPGNow and DriveThru should have on their payroll full time reviewers. The community does have reviewers, such as Crothian, and they are can either be paid for their time, receive the pdf/book before hand for free or they do it because it helps them in a way (by reviewing products, even if they had to pay for the product, they too benefit, because the time and effort in writing makes them a better writer, grants them more renown among the gaming community and this gives them more credibility). Even my writing this reply helps me become a better, if still prolix, writer.
The fans should write reviews, because if you liked the product enough to buy it and then thought it was useful or it was a good read but not useful or something else, then if you wrote a review of the product, TheLe Games could afford to do yet another book. So we are at fault (me too, I have most of his products and no reviews). Additionally, the PDF trading market is to blame. Each download of the PDF from the trading site is not registered on RPGNow.com or DriveThru, thus, in no way can it be known the real amount of actual downloads for any PDF book. Additionally, those that get the PDF via a trading site don't also write a review. Thus if there were/are 100 sales of a book on Paladins, and it shows this on the selling sites, with only 2 reviews (and one is suspect) the real amount of downloads can never really be known. Thus, while attempting to counter PDF trading sites is admirable to the masses, asking them to write reviews of your products in exchange for the taking of your book, might also be a recommendation. I'm not suggesting you embrace or say you will provide a PDF of your book if you write a review, but I am suggesting that you ask the PDF trading community to review your books and write a review. Especially since most PDF traders aren't going to be using their PDF trading name on the open market.
Unless everybody everywhere that has purchased (or illegally downloaded) TheLe Games books and has written a review, we are to "blame" for what he did as creative marketing. If we are to "blame," then we have no real basis for being unhappy with his ideas for creative marketing.
However, If you are unhappy with what you purchased based upon a review that he is responsible for, then by all means you should be able to ask for a refund. I believe that we should be able to ask for a refund of any product from any publisher that doesn't live up to the standards we believe it should. Yes, you now have their PDF product and could say "I deleted it" and I want my money back because it's a crappy product, but if you are going through that much trouble, it's likely that you're doing as you say.
If you feel that you bought a product based upon a review he is responsible for and feel that the product doesn't live up the hype from that review, then by all means you have the right to state how wrong you feel TheLe Games have acted and request not free products and not products at a reduced price but a full refund. Even if RPGNow.com /DriveThru won't honor a refund request, TheLe Games may, because that too would be good, positive and yet creative marketing.
Oh, and even if I already have the books that you'll be providing for free, I'll download them again, just so it up's your overall download numbers by 1. But it doesn't mean I'll write a review, thus I feel confident that other creative marketing - such as asking for it on an individual basis - may need to be looked into.
Thanks for reading my very prolix thoughts. I hope that those of you that believe he is in the wrong (and later use my post for arguments) look at what you have done for him as a person and for his company besides purchasing his products. Have you furthered his ability to write new and potentially exciting products or have you just purchased them and hoped that was enough? I'm in the latter, and is likely part of the reason I feel he didn't break any trust he had between myself and the products I've purchased.
Be Well.
Theocrat Issak
In His Path and Glory We Follow,
Theocrat Issak of the Church of the One True Path of Pholtus
GreyhawkOnline.com / ThePale.org / OerthJournal.com
