True20 is the ONLY 20 for me!

[Plane Sailing]

Yep. Generic, tasteless, bland. I don't mean to say there's anything wrong with liking True20. There isn't!

I just don't understand what people like so much about it. The three generic, oversimplified classes completely throw me off. I guess I just don't connect with the ruleset.

I'll try to offer some insight, in case it helps.

To people who like True20, the three generic classes:

(a) don't have an implied setting built in, so they can be used in pretty much any genre - a concept shared with the d20 modern base classes, and it would probably be quite interesting to do 'base classes' for true20 as an alternative (if that hasn't already been tackled by someone).

(b) class features are replaced by feat-per-level, which includes most standard class features anyway, thus allowing players to create highly customised characters off those base classes. A warrior with rage, increased speed, toughness and uncanny dodge vs a warrior with combat expertise, improved disarm, improved trip and two weapon fighting, say.

I'm not saying this means you should automatically like it Hopefully just giving a bit of insight in how the True20 classes can be seen as attractive by people that do like it.

Cheers

 

[wayne62682]

I have to say... reading all of these posts about True20 has really piqued my interest.. I love customization and my group tries to do it with D&D (for example, I have a ranger who swapped out the TWF/Archery styles for Sneak Attack because it fit my concept better).

I do have some questions that I hope can be answered:

- How hard is it to convert D&D stats to True20? This one is probably the big seller for me.. how much conversion work would be required?

- Does True20 have its own spells? If so, how do they compare to D&D's as far as the mechanics? Similar things? Are the "classics" (e.g. Fireball, Teleport, etc) available?

- I assume that having customized classes would remove the need for PrCs.. how about multiclassing? Does it work similar in True20? Could I feasibly make, say, a Duskblade type character (i.e. a character that can wear armor, fight reasonably well in combat and cast some spells), even if it's without all of the nifty D&D abilities?

 

[gribble]

Could I feasibly make, say, a Duskblade type character (i.e. a character that can wear armor, fight reasonably well in combat and cast some spells), even if it's without all of the nifty D&D abilities?

As far as I can tell (I could be wrong - I haven't read the book in detail) no, it isn't possible to create a decent warrior/adept at 1st level. If you don't mind him being 2nd level, it works very well with multiclassing, just not as a 1st level character.

Of course, I like the system, so I'm happy to be proven wrong here.

 

[Turanil]

Yep. Generic, tasteless, bland. <...> I just don't understand what people like so much about it.

<...> it would probably be quite interesting to do 'base classes' for true20 as an alternative (if that hasn't already been tackled by someone).

(b) class features are replaced by feat-per-level, which includes most standard class features anyway, thus allowing players to create highly customised characters off those base classes.

Me, I have been thinking about adding a couple of new base classes to True20. I think that for a setting without spellcasting priests (i.e.: D&D types of clerics), the single Adept class is okay (for example, I think True20 would be perfect for an EarthSea campaign setting). However, for replicating a D&D type of campaign using the True20 rules, I think it may be interesting to add another class that could cover clerics. As it stands, I am not convinced that the only Adept class can really differentiate between arcane and divine spellcasters.

The original first D&D game, and more recently the C&C boxed set, featured only four classes: Fighter, Cleric, Thief, and Wizard. I think that would be an interesting idea to implement in True20 (at least for replicating a D&D campaign with True20 rules) to have Warrior (fighter), Expert (rogue types), Adept (wizard), plus Initiate (cleric), and also maybe Artificer (using a Runecharger class I found on the True20 forums). Then the great thing is that with one feat per level, you can greatly customize these roles, unlike it was in original D&D.

 

[Hand of Evil]

I have to say... reading all of these posts about True20 has really piqued my interest.. I love customization and my group tries to do it with D&D (for example, I have a ranger who swapped out the TWF/Archery styles for Sneak Attack because it fit my concept better).

I do have some questions that I hope can be answered:

- How hard is it to convert D&D stats to True20? This one is probably the big seller for me.. how much conversion work would be required?

There is a conversion in the back of the book.

- Does True20 have its own spells? If so, how do they compare to D&D's as far as the mechanics? Similar things? Are the "classics" (e.g. Fireball, Teleport, etc) available?

True20 uses powers which is more PSI but TrueSorcery is True20 and spells match up to those in D&D for the most part and adds spellcaster to the True20 system.

- I assume that having customized classes would remove the need for PrCs.. how about multiclassing? Does it work similar in True20? Could I feasibly make, say, a Duskblade type character (i.e. a character that can wear armor, fight reasonably well in combat and cast some spells), even if it's without all of the nifty D&D abilities?

Multiclass works just like D&D as far as PrCs I don't see why you could not import as is into the True20 system. Will have to look more but I think it could be done.

 

[Psion]

And this, perhaps, is the making or breaking selling point of True20 in general.

Indeed it is. I enjoy d20's class based system primarily because it provides me with pre-packaged concepts in mechanical form. If I strip that out, using a class based system is less compelling to me, and I'd just as soon use something more flexible like Hero.

 

[baileyrecords]

Yes, there's a True20 rulebook. Print and PDF. Not aware of there being an SRD type document.

There is a "Preview Edition" to True20 which I suppose would serve as an SRD but to the best of my knowledge it is only avaiable in print and at conventions (possibly online but not at retail). The PE also seems to be "first edition" - pre-errata - with the errata added to the print version of the actual True20 Adventure Roleplaying hardcover book.

- Stratos

 

[baileyrecords]

Rather ironically, the entirety of the True20 mechanics is open content. So there may not be a separate SRD document, but there's nothing stopping anyone from writing one.

Very true. And it's "OGL" in the sense that Green Ronin will let you buy publishing rights (at a super inexpensive rate!) to put out your own supplements. As I stated over on the True20 forums I am looking into releasing some PDFs at RPGNow.com in `07 for my homebrew True20 campagin setting -- the same setting I opened this thread with.

Slade Chronicles by We Have Issues! Publishing

- Stratos

 

[Vigilance]

Im liking it so far, very smooth and streamlined, but still offers a lot of options.

Im working up a campaign setting for it now. It's good stuff.

Chuck

 

[Plane Sailing]

The original first D&D game, ..., featured only four classes: Fighter, Cleric, Thief, and Wizard.

I hope you don't mind me mentioning, but...

You mean the original D&D game featured only three classes: Fighter, Cleric and Wizard (and the cleric didn't get any spells until 2nd level!). The thief (and paladin) appeared in the first supplement, Greyhawk

</picky>

If someone wanted to have a cleric in a True20 game of mine, I'd probably use the Benefit feat to represent 'holy orders' and the social benefits that accrue from that. I certainly wouldn't go any further than that (but that is probably because I dislike the divine/arcane magic divide in D&D, and I'm hoping it turns into holy mooburger in future editions!)

If someone really wanted to differentiate, then they could subdivide the powers into an arcane and a divine list (with some overlap) and either then use the Adept but force them to choose, or use the Adept and give them a different 'core ability' called something like 'divine magic', so that there is a once-off differentiator.

Or you could try to really capture the spirit of 3e and make a True20 cleric class that has full BAB, all good saves and full access to all powers at all time </joke>

Cheers