Warlock Implement Questions?

[SJay]

Hey,

Was wondering if you get double the damage from an enemy attacking you if you duel wield two Pact Blades?

For that matter can you use two Rods at the same time? Say a Rod of Corruption and a Rod of Reaving? or even just a Rod of Harvest and a Rod of Corruption?

Oh also does Weapon focus or even Two-weapon fighting help damage when using a pact blade as an implement?

Cheers,
SJay

 

[PHGraves]

I would have to say "No" to all three.
The first two come up against the "Can you use two implements at the same time?" issue.
The third question runs into the "Are Pact Blades weapons when used as implements?" issue.

Saying "Yes" to the first question throws open the door to the insta-minion-kill that you must have noticed due to your hypothetical implement choices.

Saying "Yes" to the second brings about the "Since I'm concealed, I get Sneak Attack damage with the Tendrils of Thuban." issue.

I find it much easier to just say "No."

 

[eleran]

Hey,

Was wondering if you get double the damage from an enemy attacking you if you duel wield two Pact Blades?

For that matter can you use two Rods at the same time? Say a Rod of Corruption and a Rod of Reaving? or even just a Rod of Harvest and a Rod of Corruption?

Oh also does Weapon focus or even Two-weapon fighting help damage when using a pact blade as an implement?

Cheers,
SJay

No

No

Only if the power has weapon as a keyword, at which point your not using them as implements anyway. So, strictly answering the question...No.

 

[Larrin]

This post addresses whether you can gain the benefits of the 'properties' of two implements at the same time. Its not necessarily the conclusion i would have reached on my own, but i think the poster does a decent job of verify it.

http://www.enworld.org/forum/showpost.php?p=4429928&postcount=14

since the pact blade "deal damage equal to enhancement bonus when cursing" is a property, RAW and Customer Service seem to say that you could deal damage from both blades you held (ie doubling the damage assuming they both have the same enhancement). You can't use more than one implement to make an attack, or the powers of two implements in one attack, but you do get benefits of the 'properties' of any weapons/implements you hold, up to one in each hand (so two for most characters).

thus:

#1: yes....apparently.....(kinda cheesy)
#2: yes and no. You can only attack with one per turn and powers which effect the attack must come from the one you're attacking with, but you can benefit from the properties of each.
#3:definitely not. These feats specify weapons, which only contribute to a power if it has the weapon key word.

 

[Jhaelen]

No, no, and no. I don't even need to think about this one. And no, RAW don't get to have anything to say to sway my opinion on that one

 

[SJay]

Hmm,

Well I'll start with #3, I didn't really think this would work but thought I had read it somewhere and wanted to confirm.

About the other two, I personally think they would work... it says no where that you can't use (hold) two implements, just that you can't use two on one attack.

Also I specifically chose items that had the "property" keyword as opposed to an ability that needed you to attack as I knew you couldn't attack with two implements.

I guess it comes down to whether you can use two magic weapon/rod properties at the same time even though you can normally not attack with both in a single attack.

e.g Could a warlock duel wield a Dragonslayer weapon and a Pact Blade and get both of their properties? How about a ranger (multi-class to use blade)? (note that this shouldn't be a difference between ranger and straight warlock).

I guess I would have to agree with Larrin, however I can see why people would rule otherwise. Note from a flavor standpoint there is nothing wrong with it (IMO), but you could argue from a RAI or balance standpoint.

I guess I'm not going to get a definitive answer, but then my questions are generally a bit like this. Note if you can give me a definitive answer (with page numbers or reference etc) it would be much appreciated.

NOTE: I have not read the thread Larrin put up before making this post... about to read it now.

Cheers,
SJay