What would Ryan Dancey do?

[maddman75]

Great post Ryan, something I agree with. Though I've not read either magazine in several years, I can't imagine this online pay content being successful. If I'm getting it online, then how can I be sure what I'm offered is really better content than I would get from a good thread here, or RPGnet, or on countless fan sites?

If I were the grand poo-bah and had limitless power, I'd try to combine the online and gaming models with the paper RPG. The D&D minis are so successful because they work from different market vectors, and to use a buzzword have good synergy. Miniature gaming people will buy them and with the stats right on the cards may become interested in the RPG. RPG people buy them for cheap prepainted miniatures and then may try out the game. That's what happened with me - hey, I've got the rules and everything, why not try it out?

A similar strategy could work wonders with electronic gaming. Imagine a product that was a character generator that also worked as a computer game. You could take your tabletop character and put him right into an MMO - or build up a character in the MMO and export him for use in a tabletop game. It would work on the same principle. CRPGers would buy the game for the video game aspect, and thus might try out the paper RPG. D&D players could try out the computer version just as easily.

Just a thought. But a website full of pay content historically hasn't been very successful.

 

[Umbran]

If I'm getting it online, then how can I be sure what I'm offered is really better content than I would get from a good thread here, or RPGnet, or on countless fan sites?

The media by which you receive the content has never been a guarantee of the quality of that content. So, when you were getting it in a magazine, you still couldn't be sure what you were getting was better content than you could find in a good thread here, etc.

The question is not one of quality of the content, but of usefulness and quality of the presentation of that content.

 

[RyanD]

Does this in any way relate to your thoughts that there will be a "new" gaming type that may emerge in 2007?

No, that's an unrelated topic. By "new game" I mean "a whole new game platform, unlike anything we've seen before".

Do you feel this transition is/may be related to 4th edition?

Yes. I think that WotC is moving pieces on the chessboard in preparation for a 4th Edition announcement, and I expect that there will be a big electronic component of whatever that announcement is.

Mark has layed out several key moves that would indicate a 4th edition will be announced in the next 12 months. Do you agree?

Missed the list. Can someone post a link?

Could there be a move afoot to eliminate the most difficult component of the rpg gaming market, the distributor? Pros? Cons? What impact could this herald for the FLGS?

Trust me when I say that WotC could bypass distribution tomorrow without much internal disruption. They already sell directly to more stores than there are hobby game stores so logistically they already have the necessary capability. Through the Premiere Store Program they have several years experience in selling in small volumes and dealing with independent retailers. Continued use of the 3-tier system by Wizards is due to factors beyond "necessity".

I do not expect that the future of D&D is as an all electronic product, or even as a product that is primarily distributed electronically.

I believe in a hybrid future, where the core delivery is still a printed rulebook, and a game played on a tabletop using dice.

One roadmap for hybridizing with an electronic component reads like this:

1) Add on-line tools for character & monster creation accessible for a subscription fee

2) Add on-line tools for campaign management (magic items, NPCs, persistent "objects" of consequence (titles, land, relationships, etc.))

3) Deliver a stand-alone (or internet connected) service that "runs the monsters" for DMs (maximizing their lethality and ensuring that the diverse powers & abilities are put to the best use).

4) Deliver a stand-alone (or internet connected) service that manages the world environment (weather, time tracking, trade & commerce, international relations, actions of major NPCs, etc.)

5) Deliver a stand-alone (or internet connected) AI DM which can run a game by itself without human intervention.

There are various other tools that can be added along this path to add value. An on-line "dungeon creator" that could produce a final output that matched the standard D&D look & feel would be nice. A character portrait generator would be nice. A system to allow players to upload & exchange adventure content with peer-reviewed ratings & rankings would be nice.

The more you think about ways to add digital value to the D&D game, the more ideas you're likely to come up with. Once you break the box of "D&D means paper books" you start coming up with all sorts of interesting things you can do outside that box.

Is it possible that the folks at Wizards are moving from the "old" D&D gang of 80's players to the "new" demographics that may be emerging around their cards and miniatures games? Or even the MMORPG markets?

No.

If anything, the MMORPG business is a regression on the RPG model. The state of the art for online games is less flexible and far less interesting from a design & play standpoint than the tabletop environment. However, the MMORPG games are showing us by contrast what parts of the tabletop experience are dragging down interest in the format and leaving potential players out of the network. The time commitment, rules knowledge, and speed of play of the current tabletop games are negatives which need to be addressed. The system by which groups form and sustain themselves needs external support -- we need to stop leaving it up to chance.

The people at WotC certainly recognize these things. Most of the core R&D team have been working on D&D for years - often decades. They are aware that most people segment along clear lines of distinction -- people who like miniatures wargames rarely like RPGs. People who like competitive CCGs rarely like RPGs. Trying to make an RPG that appeals to those people is almost certainly doomed to failure.

Ryan

 

[ashockney]

Ryan,

Thanks as always for the insights and the quick response. Always interesting.

I liked your "chess" analogy. Mark draws some similiar conclusions here:

http://www.creativemountaingames.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=6

 

[Ourph]

1) Add on-line tools for character & monster creation accessible for a subscription fee

2) Add on-line tools for campaign management (magic items, NPCs, persistent "objects" of consequence (titles, land, relationships, etc.))

3) Deliver a stand-alone (or internet connected) service that "runs the monsters" for DMs (maximizing their lethality and ensuring that the diverse powers & abilities are put to the best use).

4) Deliver a stand-alone (or internet connected) service that manages the world environment (weather, time tracking, trade & commerce, international relations, actions of major NPCs, etc.)

5) Deliver a stand-alone (or internet connected) AI DM which can run a game by itself without human intervention.

There are various other tools that can be added along this path to add value. An on-line "dungeon creator" that could produce a final output that matched the standard D&D look & feel would be nice. A character portrait generator would be nice. A system to allow players to upload & exchange adventure content with peer-reviewed ratings & rankings would be nice.

The more you think about ways to add digital value to the D&D game, the more ideas you're likely to come up with. Once you break the box of "D&D means paper books" you start coming up with all sorts of interesting things you can do outside that box.

Ryan,

That's an outstanding analysis. I would love to see those kinds of tools become easily and readily available for the game. Are you predicting this is something that will happen or just suggesting it as a possibility for what should happen?

It seems to me that, in the past, Wizards and their licensees have struggled with bringing technology to bear on the game. Do you have any idea why that is? Do you think that's something that WotC is committed to rectifying at this point?

 

[Remathilis]

I think 1 & 2 are completely viable and NEEDED. I was a long-time user of Core Rules (1 & 2) and loved it. I was extremely disappointed with E-Tools (despite the master-tools demo) and haven't found a clean, nice UI like Core Rules had in any of the third-party generators.

However, 3-5 sound too MMO or NWN for me. It would be fun for a solo or two-player game where a computerized DM handles everything. However, how is that from NWN, WoW, or even Baldur's Gate? Computerized aid to these things would be nice, but ultimately I think the actions of NPCs, combat rounds of monsters, and actual game-running should be handled by a human.

The rest of the stuff would be WONDERFUL though. Just imagine: a dungeon generator with the following:

* Simple mapping tool that allows for tile-based maps to be made. (Akin to the Dungeon Tiles one, but with more options) along with a collection of "pre-done" maps (like the map-a-week)
* Hot-linking to a large DB of monsters, traps, NPC & treasure generators. which can print out encounter-sheets.
* access to appropriate rules (drowning, heat) that can be added to encounters.
* Print maps either in DM whole-complex or one-room at a time (sized for DDMs, of course!) with delve-style encounters!

In short, a real DM time-saver. It would garner some of my cash.

 

[Imaro]

The media by which you receive the content has never been a guarantee of the quality of that content. So, when you were getting it in a magazine, you still couldn't be sure what you were getting was better content than you could find in a good thread here, etc.

The question is not one of quality of the content, but of usefulness and quality of the presentation of that content.

But, I could browse or even read through a Dungeon or Dragon magazine, over a cup of joe in Borders and if I liked it, purchase it. So how would I be able to do this with a pay service online?

Also competition breeds quality, there's no competition for WotC so what is the driving factor for quality once they've gotten enough people to subscribe? There's no alternative and I think both of these points tie in to quality of content.

 

[Steel_Wind]

My thanks for posting your thoughts Ryan. They are appreciated.

 

[der_kluge]

Ryan Dancey doesn't *do* anything. He's got epic levels in psion. He simply wills his people into action.

Ryan Dancey once wrote 4th edition on a pinhead, then ate it. But it didn't hurt him on the inside. He's tough like that.

Ryan Dancey has 5th, 6th and 7th editions all memorized as well. He's just holding onto them "until the world is ready".

Ryan Dancey once put a portable hole inside a bag of holding, and no void showed up - out of fear of Ryan Dancey.

Killing Tiamat gives Ryan Dancey no experience - he's too high level to get XP from creatures of Tiamat's level.

Ryan Dancey automatically counterspells every spell thrown at him. Automatically!

Ryan Dancey has 25s in every ability school - using 2nd edition rules.

 

[Alnag]

Dear Mr. Dancey,

I wonder whether you think the cancelling of Dungeon and Dragon is part of wider initiative... I've just notice an announcement of cancelling of Dragonlance licence. (See: http://www.dragonlance.com/features/articles/10040.aspx).

I wonder if in your opinion it follows the idea of d20system as a medium of gradual and systemic evolution of the game. I am bit worried that WotC is missing the point. They prefere short term profit despite long term harming of the player's network, alienating the players and creating the atmosphere of distrust, anger and fear.

I would welcome any of your insights on this matter.

Alek "Alnag" Lacev
Prague, Czech republic