Wish via a Spell-like ability, any limit on XP spent?

[andargor]

Why non-epic?

I admit I took it for granted that a non-epic creature could not create an epic magical item, even with wish (a non-epic spell). I however could not find any specific reference to that, other than an epic item has "typically" a caster level above 20th.

However, taking the DMing angle, the FAQ says this about wish:

The long bullet list of effects (which includes the “undo misfortune” function) in the wish spell description shows the kinds of result you can get from the spell without any great risks. If you use one of these functions, you still pay the wish spell’s XP cost, but the wish comes out the way you want. If you try to accomplish something your DM thinks is more powerful or difficult than what appears on the bullet list, you risk unintended consequences from the wish, as noted in the spell description. Since the DM is free to devise such intended consequences, it pays to stick within the limits the spell description sets down.

Andargor

 

[Hypersmurf]

However, taking the DMing angle, the FAQ says this about wish:

The point being made is that 'create magic item' is on the list of 'safe' effects that turn out the way you want.

-Hyp.

 

[CyberSpyder]

The point being made is that 'create magic item' is on the list of 'safe' effects that turn out the way you want.

-Hyp.

And if it was intended to be limited to 'normal' magic items, that would be as simple as putting "non-epic" before the word 'magic.' Since an epic item is still a magic item, a strict reading of the rules means that you can create epic magic items with Wish.

Combine that with the Dweomerkeeper, and you have a recipe for disaster.

 

[andargor]

The point being made is that 'create magic item' is on the list of 'safe' effects that turn out the way you want.

That's what happens when you take book A, write book B a couple of years later, upgrade book A, slap A+B together, and make it available for free.



Andargor

 

[Fieari]

The Wishes granted seem to be legit, but while the rules don't support twisting words for player-cast wishes within the limits of the spell (and paying the XP cost), when getting wishes from someone else, all control is outside of the players' hands. If you aren't good at twisting words, or can't think of a way to do it, just have the djinn grant MORE than was asked for. Example:

"I want a +100 Flaming-/Shocking-/Frost-Burst Keen Vorpal Everything-Bane Greatsword"

And lo, one is created, but it's intellegent, doesn't need a wielder, and hunts down the one who made the wish. The djinn is CG, so it wouldn't unleash such a thing on the world, but sic'ing it on the person who wanted it sounds fair enough. Or perhaps you can have such a sword, with the added stipulation that it prevents you from trying to kill ANYTHING with it unless you beat its ego check, which ain't happening with those stats. Something like that.

The djinn is the one casting the spell, or SLA in this case. Even if contractually bound to do this, it still has SOME control.

 

[Jack Simth]

with the added stipulation that it prevents you from trying to kill ANYTHING with it unless you beat its ego check

Will save - 5% chance, despite a 150+ DC; once every 20 days or so....

 

[CyberSpyder]

So what if they just say

"I want a +100 Flaming-/Shocking-/Frost-Burst Keen Vorpal Everything-Bane Greatsword with no other characteristics or consequences"

I mean, that's a rather cheesy way to screw with a wish, because 'adding extra crap they don't actually want' could be done with anything. If they wish to be "more intelligent" you could grant it as more intelligent and COVERED WITH BEES.

'Grant' isn't very explicitly defined, but if the creatures could screw with the wishes they were granting, it's a reasonable bet that sane people wouldn't bother - it'd be the Twilight Zone style of wish-granting, which occurs often enough already.

 

[Particle_Man]

This reminds me of the Knights of the Dinner Table comic where Brian paid a lawyer $50 to have an "unbeatable" wish-template made up.

 

[Bront]

As for DMing, don't forget that making a wish for something outside the spell's description can be hazardous.

There is nothing that says this is the case, it's just a hold over from the older editions that did not have the same restrictions on wish as are in place now, nor the XP cost.

In any case, the simple case of DMing this is to now allow the PCs to aquire the favor of a Djinn. If they have, then they get their reward, fair and square within the rules of the game. No need to try to cheet them out of a wish by trying to twist it where there is no such reason to other than DM spite.

 

[andargor]

Just to be clear, and I'll let this one drop.

I'm not saying "screw the players". I'm saying that the description allows for specific things, and wishing for something outside of those things is hazardous. This is clearly written.

The one thing which is problematic is the magic item part, and by what's written you can wish for just about anything including epic items. I'm saying the DM should feel free to twist the words if what's being asked for is unreasonable for the campaign.

For myself, a request for a +100 vorpal adamantine humanoid/outsider/undead greatsword which dominates all creatures within a 100 ft. radius would grant one, but for about a round. And then the greater deity which owns the sword would appear and ask for it back, but give the character a +3 greatsword, +5 against humanoids, outsiders and undead in exchange (assuming the character is of a level where this is appropriate). So the player still gets something for the wish without screwing up the campaign.

IMHO, YMMV, and all that.

Andargor