Planescape- How secure are the Mazes?

Asha'man · Oct 1, 2009

It's well known that in Planescape, the Lady's Mazes are nestled in the Deep Ethereal, locked to normal plane shift spells and only have a single, hard-to-reach portal to connect with the outside.

But can't you Wish your way out? (Or in, if you need to)? If so, why not? Wish spesifically "penetrates planar barriers" when used for travel. Most of the people who were Mazed probably wouldn't have Wish available to them (Although I'd expect some, like Rowan Darkwood, would have followers who could get them out), but Factol Skall, for example, should have been able to just Wish himself out of the maze, if it were possible.

Anyone?

Phaezen · Oct 1, 2009

Considering The Lady of Pain has the ability to lock deities out of Sigil, wI doubt wish would work to escape a maze.

As for how secure they are, they are as secure as the DM needs them to be.

Stalker0 · Oct 1, 2009

Phaezen said:
As for how secure they are, they are as secure as the DM needs them to be.

I'll 2nd this. The lady of pain has always been a DM plot device, she is as strong as needs to be, as central to Sigil as she needs to be.

As for the maze, I could see it either way. To me, the Lady mazing a high level character is her equivalent of a warning shot. I'm sure she could simply kill you and bind your soul to her underwear if she wanted to get nasty.

Shemeska · Oct 1, 2009

The mazes can be inferred to be customized to their inhabitants. If wish was capable of breaking you out of a maze, then the members of the incanterium would have wished themselves to safety when their entire faction was mazed, and so would have Factol Skall of the Dustmen. But none of them ever did. Factol Vartus Timlin escaped from his Maze, but that's because he's awesome, and because he had external help from someone breaking into his maze and knowing what the portal key to the exit was. Others may have escaped, but likely they don't publicize the fact, or remain in Sigil (and since it appears you don't age in the mazes, it's possible nobody remembered who they were once they managed to escape).

There's one instance of a pre-prepared wish allowing exit from a maze, but in the process it sent the individual back several centuries in time. However that in and of itself appears to have been intentional on the part of the Lady, because it ultimately connected to other events that happened neatly before and after that "escape". The mazes/The Lady transcend the normal flow of time.

As has been said, they're as secure as a DM needs or wants them to be.

Ambrus · Oct 1, 2009

Yup. As secure as the DM deems appropriate.

That being said, there are plenty of examples of people (including the intended prisoners) leaving or entering various Lady's mazes. In one Well of Worlds adventure there appears to be something of a revolving door on Vartus Timlin's maze, leading to an odd traffic jam of sorts as people pile inside.

The Nameless One in the Torment video game eventually discovers and re-enters a maze in which he was previously trapped only to escape once more. Similarly, he and his crew later enter and then escape another maze intended to imprison Ravel Puzzlewell; only to discover that she's well aware of the way out herself but chooses not to use it.

In the Pages of Pain novel the main protagonist, the Amnesian Hero, is mazed and discovers that some (or possibly all) of the Lady's mazes are linked and encounters a small society of mazed prisoners inside. Eventually he along with a Bleaker succeed in escaping.

And of course, there's Rowan Darkwood who does indeed succeed in escaping a maze thanks to a previously prepared contingency wish. But even in escaping the Lady of Pain seems to intervene so as to cast him back in time 500 years.

So yeah, getting in and out is entirely possible as long as it's plot-appropriate.

Nymrohd · Oct 1, 2009

Skall will get out sooner rather than later, I mean he has forever and has the intelligence to manage. The lore on the mazes was not perfectly consistent (none of the rules of AD&D planescape were consistent . . .)

Personally I get the feeling that the Lady simply makes some mazes easier to escape than others. People who truly endanger Sigil or Her sovereignty will probably never get out of their mages but those mazed for lesser reasons probably have a chance to get out. Most factols tbh deserved the one way ticket since they had one or another plot that truly impinged on the Lady's authority but others should get out.

avin · Oct 1, 2009

Nymrohd said:
Personally I get the feeling that the Lady simply makes some mazes easier to escape than others. People who truly endanger Sigil or Her sovereignty will probably never get out of their mages but those mazed for lesser reasons probably have a chance to get out.

100% Agreed.

Add Planescape's Torment Nameless One to people who escaped.

kenmarable · Oct 1, 2009

As for the Mazes' security, I always found that a bit amusing in official Planescape products. They are described as the ultimate punishment by the Lady and near impossible to escape from, but then in several adventures, they have the PCs ducking in and out of Mazes by way of a secret door or there.

I know it's far more secure for the person it is intended for than for others sneaking and out, but it's still amusing that they are described with such awe, but TSR actually implemented them as pretty basic and nothing special on more than one occasion.

avin · Oct 1, 2009

Side question: is slavery common on Sigil post Faction War?

Shemeska · Oct 1, 2009

avin said:
Side question: is slavery common on Sigil post Faction War?

I would figure no more or less common than it was prior to the FW. You've got some guilds likely to oppose slavery because it's bad for their own bottom line, and some groups like the Sons of Mercy against it on principle. But you've also got newly empowered individuals filling the post-Faction political power vaccuum like Zadara, Estevan, and Shemeska who don't strike me as having a problem with it (and the last likely to enjoy turning a profit on it, or even just revel in seeing it flourish).

Planescape- How secure are the Mazes?

Asha'man

First Post

Phaezen

First Post

Stalker0

Legend

Shemeska

Adventurer

Ambrus

Explorer

Nymrohd

First Post

avin

First Post

kenmarable

Hero

avin

First Post

Shemeska

Adventurer

Similar Threads