D&D 5E To boxed text or not to boxed text

Bawylie

A very OK person
That's an example of a description where I'd want more than that single sentence. Because my players are fairly likely to poke around the place after the combat is over, and then they'll start asking questions--especially if they think it might be relevant to some other part of the plot they're looking for information on: "How long since this forge was last used? Does it look like it was used to make weapons, armor, jewelry, horseshoes? What would my character [who is from the country where this is set] know about the legendary smith?" That kind of thing.

Sure, like I said, tastes vary. My players would also probably do something similar to yours, too. I just would not mind (and even prefer) handling it myself rather than committing every site’s backstory to memory. It’s too much of my prep time for too little payoff.
 

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Satyrn

First Post
I like the idea of boxed bullet points. The stuff that almost certainly should be told to the players.

And then unboxed bullet points for the DM's discretion based on the circumstances.
 

Azzy

ᚳᚣᚾᛖᚹᚢᛚᚠ
Meh.

I like the seperation of DM and player information, but I've never liked the narration bit. This is part of what threw me off modules when I was younger (seriously, I only once ran a module when I was young because this annoyed the hell out of me).
 

Charlaquin

Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
I never even would have considered no boxed text an option. Not because I wouldn’t love it, but because it’s been part of published adventures for a long time and D&D is very reticent about breaking with tradition. I’m all for removing boxed text if that’s on the table.
 

Satyrn

First Post
I never even would have considered no boxed text an option. Not because I wouldn’t love it, but because it’s been part of published adventures for a long time and D&D is very reticent about breaking with tradition. I’m all for removing boxed text if that’s on the table.

Have you looked at Dungeon of the Mad Mage? It doesn't use boxed text.
 

Charlaquin

Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
Have you looked at Dungeon of the Mad Mage? It doesn't use boxed text.

Oh, awesomene! I haven’t picked it up yet because we’ve got a long way to go in our current Yawning Portal campaign, with Tomb of Annihilation on deck after that, followed by Dragon Heist. Definitely even more excited for Mad Mage now though!
 

Shiroiken

Legend
I've found it easier for a DM to ignore boxed text, giving their own descriptions instead, than a DM trying to make up descriptions on the fly due to their absence.
 

Boxed text (assuming it's being done correctly/sensibly) is nothing more than the DM would do themselves anyway - an introductory description of an area or event that PC's will be able to take in PRIOR to players asking for particular details or further information. This should be information that a module's author specifically intends to be relayed to players. Any details the author considers particularly relevant should be expanded upon in the full description of the room or events. If the DM is doing things sensibly/correctly, then prior to the players interacting with the module the DM will have read it IN FULL, made notes of what they PERSONALLY feel needs to be related to the players (or NOT given to them as the case may be), and any additions/changes they want to make including just binning it all and providing all their own description and narration.

The only problem I have ever really seen with boxed text is when DM's don't read it ahead of time and assess what it says or doesn't say (which includes myself of course) and make any necessary changes before it ever gets read to players. It's probably especially an issue when the boxed text is setting up a scripted event that a DM would want to run some other way, giving players and their PC's more (or less!) chance to take in information and act/react. It's never (IME) been meant to be a substitute for the DM's own gaming choices and narrative style. If DM's LET IT be that, it's their own fault. DM's have never been there to simply read the adventure AT the players, they are there to interact and generate any and all information the module doesn't as well as change any and all information that a module DOES provide if it's deemed necessary. I don't see that any failure of a DM to understand how a published adventure is meant to be used is the fault of adventure authors, unless that adventure is specifically written and marketed to DM's as a "Newbie's How-To" sort of introductory adventure.

That having all been said, I've seen some pretty lame usage, misuse, and criminal omission of boxed text over the last 40 years. DM's, newb or not, must also not be held responsible for adventure AUTHORS not using it sensibly/properly. The more that any DM DOES have to re-write (or just ignore) of an author's boxed text the more clear it is that any mutt can just write up stat blocks. If an author has particular moods, themes, visuals, etc. that they want to convey in an adventure (and not just buy a list of stat blocks and keyed map) the best way to communicate that is not with bullet points of data, but DESCRIPTION and NARRATIVE that is conveyed in boxed text. If an individual DM then chooses to eviscerate that creativity and substitute their own that's THEIR business. You sold them the adventure. At least a superficial amount of description of places, people and events in a DYNAMIC format and not just lists of data and bullet points, is, I feel, what purchasers are paying for. You can't run the game for them, but you are typically expected to provide prose portrayals of the content that don't USUALLY need to be rewritten or ignored, thus easing burden on DM's in coming up with the adventure idea itself, all the people, places, and events within it, all the relevant stat blocks and game mechanical information, AND (if the DM so chooses to avail themselves of it) initial descriptions.
 

Quickleaf

Legend
When done well, I've found text boxes to be a valuable tool for a time-harried DM to quickly grok an environment/scenario and communicate that to the players.

However, there are many examples of how boxed text can go wrong. One of my favorites comes from I-2: Tomb of the Lizard King...

[SECTION]2. Great Hall of the Brigands
As you open the unlocked door to this chamber, you find yourself peering into total darkness. Suddenly, the darkness is pierced by a brilliant light, and you hear the twang of many bowstrings![/SECTION]

Injecting "you" into boxed text is almost a guaranteed recipe for an epic fail. Using scripted events is even worse. And then not having any room description from that "brilliant light" makes you wonder what the writer of the boxed text was thinking.

Another gem comes from Gates of Firestorm Peak – though I've seen it often repeated in older modules where the monsters are described only at the end of a text box's description.

[SECTION]21 b. Kitchen
The kitchen holds all manner of cooking implements stored helter-skelter atop stone tables. Large meat hooks in the ceiling provide a sturdy support for the butchering of game creatures brought up from the underdeep. Three cots in the corner provide the goblin cooks with a place to sleep.[/SECTION]

What? Goblin cooks! Where? I was getting lured into the vivid description of objects when– whammo! There are goblin cooks!
 

pemerton

Legend
I think theoretical debates by people with 20-40 years+ gaming experience regarding fictional content and narration is great and all, but it helps to remember that not everyone has that.

Boxed text is wonderful for beginning DMs
Again, I think the people on this forum (which skews much older than the average TTRPGer) tend to forget how difficult it is to start with.

Not every person with 30+ years of experience can do without it, and it certainly helps newbie DMs.
I was once a beginning GM. The adventures I ran (most of which I also wrote) didn't have boxed text.

For an adventure targeted at a market other than experienced DMs, it is essential. It is key to training new DMs on what to describer to the players and not describe to the players. But, it should never be the only place critical information is presented.
It may be essential from a market point of view. I don't think it's key to training. More GMs were trained by Moldvay Basic than just about any other edition, and that was not a boxed text edition: neither B2 nor X1 has boxed text.

Clear descriptions are an important part of what a module should provide. But that's not the same as stipulating narration. That's why I would prefer dot points, which make key information pop off the page, to boxed text, which hides key information in a script.
 

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