Players 'distressed' by gang-rape role-playing game

MarkB · Jun 4, 2019

Bagpuss said:
Why can't some game experiences be "decidedly unpleasant"?

If you are dealing with unpleasant issues like "straight camps", wouldn't you expect there be decidedly unpleasant issues occurring?

That part wasn't on the sign-up sheet. From the description on the sheet, it could just as easily have been "summer camp for monsters", and as mentioned by other posters, a "mature content" warning covers a lot of ground - it could as easily have meant explicit language, graphic violence, consensual sexual content, or any of a number of things.

It was only once we got to the table that we were given more of an idea of the general scenario, and even that description didn't really hint at what it devolved into later in the game.

See this is where I have an issue with the X-Card, use of an X-Card in a game like this by one player that doesn't like an unpleasant situation, kills the whole concept of the scenario for everyone else that might actually be interested in exploring these unpleasant issues in the safety of fictional roleplay game.

Are five peoples' interest really worth one person's emotional turmoil? Is sticking a big M on your table really any excuse for putting absolutely any conceivable topic, no matter how distateful, on the table?

Ralif Redhammer · Jun 4, 2019

Okay, so I really don't buy that YouTube alternate account of events. It's the channel of James Desborough, whom a brief Google search shows to be exactly the sort of person you'd expect to come to the defense of this GM.

Ralif Redhammer said:
Not sure I buy that account, either,

dragoner · Jun 4, 2019

Bagpuss said:
Why can't some game experiences be "decidedly unpleasant"?

There is a certain irony in this statement in that it appears that the GM had a decidedly unpleasant game experience in being ejected from the con. You reap what you sow.

Staffan · Jun 4, 2019

Bagpuss said:
It’s my understanding that while Tales from the Loop is a more ‘kids on bikes’ game, Things from the Flood is more of a horror game with more adult content. Is that right?
No, both are darkly mature games. Anyone who has read the books, knows this. Just a read through of the scenarios in Tales from the Loop shows it’s an 18+ game.

This dude must have read a different Tales from the Loop than I have (I have not read Things from the Flood, which I understand has older PCs and more "mature" themes). While there are bad things happening near the Loop, I wouldn't call it "darkly mature". The game suggests the Kids should have problems like "The tough guys always hit me" or "I cannot read very well and they want to put me in a special class" or "My mother drinks a lot" - things that can be alienating and bond them together with the other Kids, but I wouldn't call that sort of thing "Darkly mature".

And the scenarios I've played so far in Tales of the Look (two at cons and two at home) have been:

[sblock]* Toy manufacturers are launching a new line of Swedish-made knock-off Transformers toys. Turns out they aren't just toys but actual mini-robots that are turning hostile and the kids have to figure out why and how to stop them.
* NPC kids go missing, and the PCs learn that they were planning on having a party near the abandoned "haunted" cabin outside town. Kids go there, investigate, may start hallucinating some things, explore some more and find a tunnel leading to a government lab where something went very wrong leading to leaks of a fear gas.
* Some people report seeing "monsters" around town. Kids investigate and learn that it's because one of the weirder adults is hijacking one of the Loop supercomputers to make perfect pirated VHS tapes at home, and that supercomputer is also connected to a machine that builds robots, and then starts building robots that look like the things on her horror movie tapes.
* The library seems to be haunted. Turns out it's the result of a scientist experimenting with a teleporting machine which made him, as well as the Russians spying on him, go out of phase and be almost entirely unable to affect the actual world.[/sblock]

These may all have some disturbing elements, but nothing I'd call "darkly mature".

Imaculata · Jun 4, 2019

I've ran multiple adult campaigns in my life, some of which included sexual (consensual) content. But I would never dare to run any such campaign at a con with random people, and I would always inform my players what they are about to play, and discuss how I intend to deal with the more edgy material. Usually it involves a 'fade to black', because playing out what exactly happens is just gross and kinda creepy. But I'm not above including scenes of torture and brutal violence, as long as my players are on board with that. And if any of my players include women, I will always adjust the scenario accordingly. Because some things that are okay between a group of just guys, are kind of awkward when women are present. Likewise, I always take into account things my players may be sensitive to, such as religious themes, if any of my players happen to be religious. These are the sort of things I tend to discuss openly with my players, before starting play.

That said, I've never met any DM or player who thinks rapey scenarios are okay, or fun for the players in ANY campaign. But I think it says a lot about a person who thinks that they are.

Bagpuss · Jun 4, 2019

MarkB said:
Are five peoples' interest really worth one person's emotional turmoil? Is sticking a big M on your table really any excuse for putting absolutely any conceivable topic, no matter how distateful, on the table?

The point is the person is free to leave it's not forcing them to stay and suffer emotional turmoil. With X-Card the person is still going to experience enough to be triggered or else they won't feel the need to touch the X-Card. The X-Card isn't going to prevent emotional turmoil, if anything the M-Card is more likely to as a person if forewarned.

MrDM69 · Jun 4, 2019

My friend was DM-ing once and our characters did go through rape, but that entire adventure was just a joke, and he was just saying the weirdest things he could think of. He also just said "and they raped you" and left it at that, and I was thankful he didn't go into description. Once again that adventure was just a joke, and me and the other player were totally okay with it (we were all guys).

dragoner · Jun 4, 2019

Ralif Redhammer said:
Okay, so I really don't buy that YouTube alternate account of events. It's the channel of James Desborough, whom a brief Google search shows to be exactly the sort of person you'd expect to come to the defense of this GM.

Yes, he wrote "In Defense Of Rape", so that his coming to their defense is but damning with faint praise.

MarkB · Jun 4, 2019

Bagpuss said:
The point is the person is free to leave it's not forcing them to stay and suffer emotional turmoil. With X-Card the person is still going to experience enough to be triggered or else they won't feel the need to touch the X-Card. The X-Card isn't going to prevent emotional turmoil, if anything the M-Card is more likely to as a person if forewarned.

I dislike the concept of the M-Card as it feels like a challenge rather than a safety feature. It's saying "are you edgy and adult enough to play at my table?"

And then if a player who wasn't expecting to have difficulties with the content finds that something unexpectedly comes up that does bother him, it's like a commitment. "I promised I'd be mature and edgy enough to be in this game - I can't back out now, they won't respect me!"

Bagpuss · Jun 4, 2019

MarkB said:
I dislike the concept of the M-Card as it feels like a challenge rather than a safety feature. It's saying "are you edgy and adult enough to play at my table?"

So you consider content warnings are a challenge?

And then if a player who wasn't expecting to have difficulties with the content finds that something unexpectedly comes up that does bother him, it's like a commitment. "I promised I'd be mature and edgy enough to be in this game - I can't back out now, they won't respect me!"

Nope, it's very clear there is no commitment to remain in a situation you are uncomfortable with, in fact there is a very clear indication that you should remove yourself from such situations.

How you can read "You are accepting that if you have an issue with anything in the game it’s on you to excuse yourself from the scene or game with minimal disruption to everyone else at the table." as a commitment to remain at the table?