Marks and other conditions being known
- Thread starter Sal
- Start date
Page 57, second column, last paragraph.
Any creature affected by a power know that it is affected and knows who did it. Creatures are always aware of all conditions affecting them and the source of the condition.
(Since the whole point of marking a creature is to make him attack you, it would be pretty useless if the creature didn't know how marked it! It's NOT supposed to be "I give the creature a -2 to attack anyone else and then hope he doesn't attack me!". The "Cowardice" power source isn't supposed to come out until PHB3.)
Any creature affected by a power know that it is affected and knows who did it. Creatures are always aware of all conditions affecting them and the source of the condition.
(Since the whole point of marking a creature is to make him attack you, it would be pretty useless if the creature didn't know how marked it! It's NOT supposed to be "I give the creature a -2 to attack anyone else and then hope he doesn't attack me!". The "Cowardice" power source isn't supposed to come out until PHB3.)
Tony Vargas
Legend
4e is aparently meant to be played very much 'above board.' The players know exactly what the monsters do to them, the DM doesn't have to pretend he doesn't know what the players are doing to his monsters, and everyone is apraised of the consequences of thier actions before they take them. Not realistic, but fair.
The in-character F/X of a fighter's 'mark' seems to be that the fighter attacks with such ferocity and persistence that the enemy cannot turn his attention away from him without a substantial risk. The 'marked' target would certainly be aware that there's a scale-armored maniac all up in his face, trying to kill him.
The in-character F/X of a fighter's 'mark' seems to be that the fighter attacks with such ferocity and persistence that the enemy cannot turn his attention away from him without a substantial risk. The 'marked' target would certainly be aware that there's a scale-armored maniac all up in his face, trying to kill him.
Last edited:
Well creatures know conditions on them but they should not know what class abilities you have.
E.g., I mark a Kobold as a fighter. It shifts and I smack it (it should not know about combat challenge). Next round my ranger/fighter multiclass buddy decides to mark this Kobold. It should "assume" that this guy is able to smack him if he shifts. The DM should not "know" that the multi-class ranger does not have combat challenge and cannot in fact take that attack if it shifts.
E.g., I mark a Kobold as a fighter. It shifts and I smack it (it should not know about combat challenge). Next round my ranger/fighter multiclass buddy decides to mark this Kobold. It should "assume" that this guy is able to smack him if he shifts. The DM should not "know" that the multi-class ranger does not have combat challenge and cannot in fact take that attack if it shifts.
Well, the way the rules are written, the creature knows ALL EFFECTS of any power used on him -- including that if he's marked by you and he shifts, you can whack him. The point is to allow creatures to make intelligent tactical decisions, and not burden the DM with trying to second-guess what the creature knows. Maybe the kobold has faced fighters before and can see by your stance and position that you're going to be able to swing at him no matter how cautiously he moves.
Does it know a fighter's OAs stop movement in that case? If so, how does it determine you're a fighter and not ranger or rogue, or even a paladin?
The point was I wasn't sure I'd include the combat challenge ability as part of the power used to mark something. What if I mark it with some other fighter power? I can still use combat challenge attacks it if its marked by one of those specific marking powers fighters get.
Like I (and others) have said: You can work out if the kobold may or may not know all the possibilities, or just have a blanket rule that he does, and that's that.
He does know he's marked; he knows whatever power was used to mark him and what it can do. He DOESN'T know the fighter's inventory of powers, so if the fighter has something which he can only do to a marked target, the kobold probably wouldn't know that until it was used on him. Once a power is used, though, he knows all effects *of that power*.
So, if Power 1 is "Mark the target" and Power 2 is "+5 to hit a marked target", the kobold knows he's marked, but doesn't know the fighter might get a +5 to hit him next turn (if the fighter chooses to use that power). OTOH, if a power is "Target is marked; the fighter gains +5 to hit that target", the kobold knows both effects, since they're part of the same power.
Stormtower
First Post
Be careful with your rules interpretation here. The attack provided by the fighter's Mark/Combat Challenge when an enemy shifts/attacks someone else is an immediate reaction, not an OA. Thus, it is limited to only once per round and does NOT stop movement, nor does the fighter receive his Wisdom modifier as a bonus to the attack.
I am aware of this. The OA question was another question in trying to determine what a monster knew.
I have uploaded a text file regarding this issue. It is a series of emails between Hypersmurf and a customer service rep, that I copied and pasted into a text file (I would link to the thread I copied it from, but I can't remember it's title).
The cust serv gives a series of responses which contradict each other, and then finishes by saying that it was always the intent of the designers that DMs determine how much monsters know. Interpret that how you will.
The cust serv gives a series of responses which contradict each other, and then finishes by saying that it was always the intent of the designers that DMs determine how much monsters know. Interpret that how you will.
Similar Threads
AD6_gamerati_skyscraper
Recent & Upcoming Releases
-
April 16 2024 -
May 31 2024 -
June 3 2024 -
June 4 2024 -
June 18 2024 -
July 16 2024 -
September 17 2024 -
October 1 2024 -
November 12 2024 -
February 18 2025
