4e Annoyances for those who like 4e

[Dausuul]

I may have been a touch pedantic. I do that. Occupational hazard.

Eh, no problem. I get excessively pedantic on a regular basis. Mostly I wanted to say, "Um... wait a sec, this point that I'm defending, I just realized it's pretty shaky and your position is a good deal stronger, and it's not really relevant to the main topic anyway, so I'm gonna back off now and make a few harrumphing noises in an effort to save face."

 

[Henry]

Yes - in earlier editions (at least as far back as 2nd), hit points represented a whole bunch of things...

Even Gygax in the first DMG commented that (paraphrasing) hit points didn't represent that a 4th level fighter could take the punishment of a draft horse...

 

[Ssadral]

The necessity of the battlegrid.

Hear, hear!

*Golf Clap*

 

[yesnomu]

I like 4e a lot, but I do have some issues, being on both sides of the screen:

-Tiny attack and defense modifiers thrown around--I can keep track alright, but the new players have trouble keeping it all straight and doing the math. Our Ranger took Group Quarry (a conditional +1 to damage), which is frankly too much trouble for too little damage. Maptools games are nice for this.

-Math issues in the base game; Expertise et al. It's not at all hard to see or fix, without inventing new must-have feats. +1 to attacks and NADs at Paragon and Epic is perfectly sufficient.

-I'd like to see non-combat roles, like Face, Acquirer, Planner, or Transporter, added to the game, separate from combat mechanics. Too often, there's little incentive for people to participate outside of combat, and I'd like to make that participation easier and more central to the game.

-Sloooow errata pace. The July stuff was great, where's the Arcane/Divine/Primal Power errata? Believe you me, there's stuff that deserves it. Unfortunately, this is probably related to the quick pace of product release, which I do like a lot.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Monsters with lower AC than their equippment + level (+stats) would give to players.

Why not just give monsters no armor then?

 

[Dragonbait]

- Classes are a bit TOO narrowly defined. I know it's a team game but sometimes when I have to play the "Leader" role I'm not too fond of any of the leader classes. I would like to be able to choose different builds and feats with some of the other classes to fill alternate roles. In my limited experience with the PHB2 classes I saw this in the druid, who seemed to be both a controller and a striker. I'd like to see more of that.

- The "Leader" role name. I've experienced a number of players who see that and can't wrap their head around the idea that Leader classes do not mean Leader characters. It's just a concept.

I used to list the grind on here, but ever since my group reached levels 8+ I've noticed that it is a lot less apparent. Now it only feels like a grind when either the players are slowing down or I have to control many different types of monsters in one battle.

Well.. I also declare a monster dies without making the PCs keep attacking it when it's the last one on the grid.

 

[Joshua Randall]

A couple people mentioned, regarding magic items:

* Daily power activation too fiddly
* way, way too many overly specific items

The combination of these two has led me to shun actively any item with a Daily power. It's just too much of a pain in the butt to troll through all the items looking for that one power that might be useful once a day.

Instead I get to troll through all the items looking for that one Property that is probably useful most of the time. Ugh, sometimes I hate myself.

But still... I know there is large segment of players who really like all... those... items. So I guess they are happy.

 

[Dausuul]

But still... I know there is large segment of players who really like all... those... items. So I guess they are happy.

Is there? I'm not convinced. All the players I know, including me, do what you describe - look for items with useful properties and more or less ignore the dailies.

I think this calls for a poll!

(Edit: Or were you talking about the overall profusion of hyper-specific magic items, as opposed to hyper-specific magic items with daily powers?)

 

[Mircoles]

Daily power only magic items. A magic item should something more than once a day.

I don't really the once per day neat trick, but have the item do something all the time, even if it's simply a +1 bonus to something.

 

[Dausuul]

Daily power only magic items. A magic item should something more than once a day.

I don't really the once per day neat trick, but have the item do something all the time, even if it's simply a +1 bonus to something.

Uh... you missed a few words there...