Converting monsters from Dragon magazine

[Cleon]

I could go either way on that. There is something sensible about using the monstrous spider advancement, though.

Sensible? I didn't get where I am today by being sensible!

Maybe it would help if we considered the Bite damage. If we start at, say, 1d4, it would go:

Normal Monster Advancement:
Small --- Str 4, Bite 1d4-3 -(average 1)-- Base
Medium -- Str 8, Bite 1d6-1 -(average 2.5) +1.5
Large -- Str 16, Bite 1d8+4 -(average 8.5) +6
Huge --- Str 24, Bite 2d6+10 (average 17)- +8.5

Monstrous Spider Advancement:
Small -- Str 10, Bite 1d4 - (average 2.5 ) Base
Medium - Str 14, Bite 1d6+3 (average 6 .5) +4
Large -- Str 18, Bite 1d8+6 (average 10.5) +4
Huge --- Str 22, Bite 2d6+9 (average 16)-- +6

Of those the Monstrous Spider version gives a much more linear progression, while the normal advancement gives a sudden jump in damage from Medium to Large.

Bearing that in mind, I think I prefer the Monstrous Spider version.

 

[Shade]

Added the Small version to Homebrews.

Do we want the poison and web to scale with size, like the monstrous spider? It sounds like its poison should deal Con damage, since it is lethal.

Since the creature is essentially the same creature throughout its size changes, I'd recommend we keep feats and skill ranks the same across the board. Should we base them off its smallest or largest incarnation?

Retain the monstrous spider's skill modifiers?

Give 'em telepathy like most demons?

 

[freyar]

Yes to scaling, smallest size for feats and skills, yes to telepathy and spider skill modifiers.

 

[Cleon]

Yes to scaling, smallest size for feats and skills, yes to telepathy and spider skill modifiers.

I will back the poison scaling with size and HD (since it goes along with their bite damage scaling) and having their skills and feats fixed to their lowest level (since it's simpler). Not so sure about the telepathy, since they aren't "true" demons, but if you want it I won't say no.

 

[Shade]

Basing on the smallest incarnation, we'll have 8 skills at 6 ranks and 2 feats.

Skills: Balance, Hide, Jump, Listen, Move Silently, Search, Spot, Tumble?

For the monstrous spider racial skills modifiers, should we consider these web-spinning spiders, hunting spiders, or both?

Shall we wait on the feats to see if there's a need for Ability Focus?

For the poison, shall we follow the monstrous spider's damage progression, swapping Str with Con?

 

[freyar]

They seem to be able to throw webs at single targets, so let's go with web-spinners. And I agree to save the feats. Using monstrous spider poison progression works for me!

 

[Shade]

Updated.

 

[freyar]

Have we settled on a HD progression for these?

 

[Cleon]

Basing on the smallest incarnation, we'll have 8 skills at 6 ranks and 2 feats.

Skills: Balance, Hide, Jump, Listen, Move Silently, Search, Spot, Tumble?

For the monstrous spider racial skills modifiers, should we consider these web-spinning spiders, hunting spiders, or both?

Shall we wait on the feats to see if there's a need for Ability Focus?

For the poison, shall we follow the monstrous spider's damage progression, swapping Str with Con?

Those skills looks good to me.

Definitely prefer the web-spinner racial bonuses to them, since they throw webs and resemble black widows.

I'd prefer to up the poison damage from the Monstrous Spider. The original has a lethal bite, so 1d3/1d3 Con may not be enough. Perhaps up it to 1d6 or 1d8, increasing with larger sizes? Something like:

Small - 1d8
Medium - 1d10
Large - 2d6
Huge - 2d8

 

[Cleon]

Have we settled on a HD progression for these?

I'd suggested one earlier, but can't remember how much agreement it got:

Small - 3HD
Medium - 5HD
Large - 7 HD
Huge - 10 HD

If we combine that with Monstrous Spider ability advancement we get:

Small -- HD 3, Str 10, Dex 17, Con 14, Bite 1d4 - (poison 1d3 or 1d8?)
Medium - HD 5, Str 14, Dex 17, Con 16, Bite 1d6+3 (poison 1d4 to 1d10?)
Large -- HD 7, Str 18, Dex 17, Con 16,Bite 1d8+6 (poison 1d6 to 2d6?)
Huge -- HD 10, Str 22, Dex 17, Con 18,Bite 2d6+9 (poison 1d8 to 2d8?)