Scott Thorne, a retailer, comments on recent events

[Dannyalcatraz]

And WotC's savvy notwithstanding, there is the real question as to how many people want online content to replace rather than supplement physical gaming products.

 

[Imaro]

And WotC's savvy notwithstanding, there is the real question as to how many people want online content to replace rather than supplement physical gaming products.

Agree here as well. Their loss of marketshare, at least as far as books go... as well as the flip flopping of both the direction and design of their products has me doubting that WotC even knows what their fans really want or rather if that is what is actually driving their decision making process.

I know their fans certainly wanted/want PDF's. The funny thing is having the 3.5 PDF's might have stopped or at least slowed down many people's migration to Pathfinder... but with the 3.5 books (especially core) skyrocketing in price... the Pathfinder corebook, which acts as PHB and DMG (and is only around $30 on Amazon), became an even more attractive way to continue with the 3.5 rules.

 

[DaveMage]

I think we're in an interesting period of transition with regard to print vs. digital content delivery - and I'm not only referring to RPGs.

With devices like the kindle, iPad, etc., I think all publishers are going to have to make content available in multiple ways.

I don't think the technology is quite there yet (though it's close), but I will be much happier bringing a better 1lb iPad (for example) to a gaming session than 10+ lbs. of books - once the digital eReaders provide a superior experience (for me), and they are very, very close to doing so.

I like how as a Paizo subscriber I get both a hard copy and PDF so that *I* get to choose (at no additional charge or effort) how *I* want content delivered and used in particular circumstances.

 

[carmachu]

but you can't say "without the OGL there would be no 4ed", as there would have been a new edition in the future, or that Mearls would have not come up with the same style of game sans OGL. He could have done it in a fanzine.

I certainly can. Without OGL 4e would probably not look like it does now. A new edition coming alont? Absolutely. New editionthat look slike 4e? Probably not.

You have ZERO evidence that Mearls would have done so via a fanzine. In fact I'd hazard to say less then zero. Your just throwing stuff against the wall to see what sticks in that particular case.

The game exists separately from the OGL. The OGL is a simple license, not a philosophy or even a game. D&D exists outside of the OGL. People have been tinkering with the game since 1974. All the OGL does is make it easier to publish, that's pretty much it. Was the OGL a factor, yes? Is the OGL the sole reason 4e is the way it is, I doubt it.

It's a license, not a philosophy or a religion. The creative interest in game design has existed outside of the licenses.

the license allowed unparallel items to come about. It most certainly could be argued that its alo a philosphy for the game, that allowed more creativity and diversity to happen then any other point in gaming. Even more so then "tinkering with the game since 1974"

Sole reason? No. But dismissing it had nothing to do with it is rather foolish.

 

[ssampier]

And WotC's savvy notwithstanding, there is the real question as to how many people want online content to replace rather than supplement physical gaming products.

Good point. I do consider Paizo Pathfinder's PDF products to be a different product than DI, though. That's why I wasn't quite ready to say to argue paper versus digital.

To me the current focus on DI has Wizards management spell-bound, but at the same time a bit lost. To really do DI right they should partner with a company that really understands electronic products. Their license for D&D games, however, hasn't been going well so far, so I can somewhat understand their reluctance.

Wizards has back-pedaled from DI a bit, making those random, semi-collectible cards mandatory for tournaments. That just confuses me. I am not quite sure how that fits in with the whole electronic & book thing. Do they really expect people to buy all three?

 

[Matt James]

Wizards has back-pedaled from DI a bit, making those random, semi-collectible cards mandatory for tournaments. That just confuses me. I am not quite sure how that fits in with the whole electronic & book thing. Do they really expect people to buy all three?

Wait. What? What tournaments? Fortune Cards are optional content for the system. If you're talking about the D&D Encounters organized play events, that's just a way to get people into the store to learn D&D and hock the new products--nothing close to a tournament.

 

[BryonD]

I think we're in an interesting period of transition with regard to print vs. digital content delivery - and I'm not only referring to RPGs.

With devices like the kindle, iPad, etc., I think all publishers are going to have to make content available in multiple ways.

I don't think the technology is quite there yet (though it's close), but I will be much happier bringing a better 1lb iPad (for example) to a gaming session than 10+ lbs. of books - once the digital eReaders provide a superior experience (for me), and they are very, very close to doing so.

Yep.
A lot of people who swore they would never give up on vinyl are walking around with their entire music library on an IPod.


Digital WILL replace paper and in the not so distant future.
And, assuming cloud based technology also evolves to keep up, the distinction between a PDF on an IPad and a DDI-type service may be very hard to identify.

 

[shadzar]

Wait. What? What tournaments? Fortune Cards are optional content for the system. If you're talking about the D&D Encounters organized play events, that's just a way to get people into the store to learn D&D and hock the new products--nothing close to a tournament.

No. Fortune cards will be a required component/purchase for more advanced players, beyond initial introduction to the game. This was mentioned specifically on the product page FOR Fortune Cards.

These will be "organized play events" ran in stores but not for new players, for more "experienced" as the product information page proclaims.

Wizards Play Network Official Home Page

For some Wizards Play Network programs aimed at experienced players, Fortune Card purchase will be a requirement to participate,

 

[Nagol]

Wait. What? What tournaments? Fortune Cards are optional content for the system. If you're talking about the D&D Encounters organized play events, that's just a way to get people into the store to learn D&D and hock the new products--nothing close to a tournament.

There's a new in-store play program starting in September that seems designed specifically to use the cards.

Dungeons & Dragons Roleplaying Game Official Home Page - Article (A New D&D In-Store Play Program)

 

[JohnRTroy]

I certainly can. Without OGL 4e would probably not look like it does now. A new edition coming alont? Absolutely. New editionthat look slike 4e? Probably not.

You have ZERO evidence that Mearls would have done so via a fanzine. In fact I'd hazard to say less then zero. Your just throwing stuff against the wall to see what sticks in that particular case.

You're making the classic cum hoc ergo propter hoc statement. I'm not "throwing stuff against the wall". You are implying that there is a DIRECT, rather than INDIRECT, link between 4ed and the OGL. This is what you are saying.

Mearls works on Iron Realms, which seems to be a prototype for 4e
Iron Realms used the OGL
Therefore, the OGL is responsible 4e.

You are also ignoring the traditional means of how others in the gaming field got their jobs. You are ignoring plenty of other considerations.

Mearls worked under Monte Cook, a popular 3e publisher which probably got a lot more attention and may have opened up enough doors for him. Monte was akin to (in the per OGL days) a major publisher.

It was the talent of Mearls that was the primary draw, and I suspect had there been no OGL, Mearls would have eventually ended up at WoTC.

I would have to say my "evidence" is greater than yours, as I am at least looking at the history of how people got their jobs.

It most certainly could be argued that its alo a philosphy for the game, that allowed more creativity and diversity to happen then any other point in gaming. Even more so then "tinkering with the game since 1974"

I don't dismiss it totally, but I dislike the whole "OGL Worship" I see where the license becomes more important or just as important as the game. And I think one negative of the OGL is that we've ended up going backwards. Instead of being creative the largest game publishers now sort of use a single base. I think if the 3e system didn't dominate we would have had stronger alternatives to the D&D system, like we had in the 80s and 90s.