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D&D 5E I have something... THE TARRASQUE!

Sonny

Adventurer
To save space most likely. Surely the sphinx isn't the only monster with that attribute.

Well, it wouldn't really make sense for the Tarrasque to have that kind of attack. It's just a big dumb force of nature that happens to be very tough and who's hide and shell and thick enough to be immune normal weapons and able to reflect magic at times. Nothing about the creature itself is steeped in magic. Unlike the Sphinx which most definitely is a magical creature whose attacks would naturally be considered magical.
 

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Hussar

Legend
Well, it wouldn't really make sense for the Tarrasque to have that kind of attack. It's just a big dumb force of nature that happens to be very tough and who's hide and shell and thick enough to be immune normal weapons and able to reflect magic at times. Nothing about the creature itself is steeped in magic. Unlike the Sphinx which most definitely is a magical creature whose attacks would naturally be considered magical.

LOL. The Tarrasque isn't a magical beastie? Really? Immortal force of nature that is a hundred feet tall? I'd call that pretty magical myself. And, if you look at earlier editions which used magical weapon defences, they never, ever called it out in the stat block that creatures that need magical weapons to be hit can hit other creatures that need magical weapons to be hit.

Derren is simply playing silly buggers games because he can. If this proves not to be true when the DMG or wherever that rule is located comes out? Then we can complain. But, hey, by all means, keep theory crafting. After all, being continuously negative is working out well so far isn't it? Sheesh. I mean, we likely don't even have the full Tarraque entry and we're already whinging about the rules.
 

I suddenly want to run a campaign where some horrific thing arrives from the lower planes or from the stars, and the only chance humanity has is for someone (i.e. the PCs) to find and wake the tarrasque to fight it.
 

Sonny

Adventurer
LOL. The Tarrasque isn't a magical beastie? Really? Immortal force of nature that is a hundred feet tall? I'd call that pretty magical myself. And, if you look at earlier editions which used magical weapon defences, they never, ever called it out in the stat block that creatures that need magical weapons to be hit can hit other creatures that need magical weapons to be hit.

Derren is simply playing silly buggers games because he can. If this proves not to be true when the DMG or wherever that rule is located comes out? Then we can complain. But, hey, by all means, keep theory crafting. After all, being continuously negative is working out well so far isn't it? Sheesh. I mean, we likely don't even have the full Tarraque entry and we're already whinging about the rules.

It's a discussion. We have differing opinions. I don't see what the big deal is?

I look at this Tarrasque more like Godzilla, a non magic huge bulldozer. We haven't seen anything to imply he's immortal in this edition, very long lived maybe. No wish spell needed to kill him or regeneration so far. And size doesn't matter, a hill giant is large, but far from magical in the D&D world. This editions Tarrasque is simply very tough to kill. He still needs to feed as well. Unlike the sphinx. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. Not the first time nor the end of the world to me. :p
 

the Jester

Legend
...if you look at earlier editions which used magical weapon defences, they never, ever called it out in the stat block that creatures that need magical weapons to be hit can hit other creatures that need magical weapons to be hit.

But it does seem to be in this edition, ergo, the tarrasque probably doesn't count as a magic weapon when it attacks.

OTOH it probably can just pick you up and hurl you into the middle of that lake over there.
 


pemerton

Legend
This shorthand to create an exciting and engaging game and is no worse than turn based structure.

<snip>

The derogatory term "gameist" should be reserved for rules so blatantly unrealistic that their entire reason for existing lies in the rules. Cube shaped fireballs is a great example of this.

<snip>

Also realize it is a derogatory term as likely to start edition war fights as not, and should be avoided.
There is a degree of tension in your post, I think. After all, one person's "blatant unrealisticness" is another person's "shorthand to create an exciting and engaging game". If you want the ingame rationale - the flame at the edge of the fireball is cool enough that it is not going to hurt anyone; hence we don't bother keeping track of it for combat resolution purposes.

Yet the reason why the adventurer gets away (unless other creatures join the combat, even if they are on his side) is not because the DM decides that the narrative would be better (although he might certainly believe that, too), but because the rules say that under this circumstances the Tarrasque moves slower.
This was answered by [MENTION=177]Umbran[/MENTION], but I want to state my agreement with him: a rule that says that, as the number of PCs in play drops, so the fury of the NPC/monster drops, is a rule for pacing the action, and managing climaxes and denouement within the context of a combat encounter. You may not like such mechanics, but they're hardly revolutionary in RPG design. Legendary actions are one version of such mechanics, designed to fit within D&D's combat turn structure.

If you want to rationalize it that way to yourself fine. Too bad that it doesn't work that way with the Sphinx.
What are you talking about? As the sphinx defeats its foes, it first stops casting spells against them (3 actions required), then stops teleporting (2 actions required). So we reach a climax, of the sphinx facing off against its final foe, claw vs [whatever].

That's a pacing mechanic that is apt to push the story in a definite direction. You might think it's a poor story - in which case you'll want to rewrite or not use the sphinx - but that doesn't change the fact that it advances a particular story.

Why can the Sphinx only teleport when enemies are around but not when it is alone?
That might be true at your table. At my table the sphinx can teleport to its heart's content when it is alone. The reason for putting the teleportation ability into the legendary actions is to give the GM advice on what is the best way to implement Sphinxish teleportation in the context of a fight between the sphinx and PCs adjudicated within the turn-by-turn, round-by-round combat resolution system.

take the Sphinx which is prevented from flying and caught in a wall of fire or similar effect. It spends its move trying to get out but does not manage it and thus takes damage. Now the attacking wizard casts another spell and suddenly the Sphinx teleports out of the fire. Why only after the fire burned it and not before?
Because it took time to muster its magical energies? Because teleporting is hard, so it tried to move out naturally at first, but then when it found itself unable to, and starting to burn, it teleported instead?

Use your imagination!

I suddenly want to run a campaign where some horrific thing arrives from the lower planes or from the stars, and the only chance humanity has is for someone (i.e. the PCs) to find and wake the tarrasque to fight it.
Now this the best post of the thread, and may well feed into my 4e campaign, which is at about the right level for the tarrasque! (But sorry, the XP well is dry at present.)
 

Scorpio616

First Post
It's extra actions are presented in a gamist way because it is a game and this game assumes a party of about 4 adventurers. If not enough characters are around nobody except a barracks room rules lawyer will balk if the DM decides it gets it's untaken legendary actions after all other present foes have taken their turns.
 

Derren

Hero
LOL. The Tarrasque isn't a magical beastie? Really? Immortal force of nature that is a hundred feet tall? I'd call that pretty magical myself. And, if you look at earlier editions which used magical weapon defences, they never, ever called it out in the stat block that creatures that need magical weapons to be hit can hit other creatures that need magical weapons to be hit.

So are giants magical now because they are big? And as you haven't noticed, the 5E Tarrasque is not immortal.
As the Jester already said, the explicit mention of the magical weapon ability in the Sphinx entry shows that this edition it is different than in previous ones and that ability is not automatic based on immunities.

By the way, you have an interesting way of dealing with opinions you do not like.

What are you talking about? As the sphinx defeats its foes, it first stops casting spells against them (3 actions required), then stops teleporting (2 actions required). So we reach a climax, of the sphinx facing off against its final foe, claw vs [whatever].

Thats not how legendary actions work. Teleporting takes 2 of the 3 uses the Sphinx has each turn, but they are not dependent on the number of creatures involved. The Sphinx can teleport just fine with only one enemy left, refuting your pacing theory.
That might be true at your table. At my table the sphinx can teleport to its heart's content when it is alone.

How was that fallacy called that the ability of houseruling doesn't solve the underlying problem? As written the Sphinx can not teleport on its own, making legendary action a gameist rule.
 

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