I suck at DMing. Can anyone help?

[tdewitt274]

First off, I appreciate all the input. While I haven't looked at all the referring links, I will get to them as I read though the threads another time or two.

Wicht, Goatunit, and Rune bring up good points that I haven't thought about, the top down approach where you create the story around the people and events.

Umbran brings up a good point regarding who makes the story. I somewhat disagree that the DM doesn't create the story. True, the Players create the story, but the story wouldn't exist without the DM. I feel that it's up to the DM to create the backbone and let the players flesh it out. The story wouldn't exist without the DM.

While "stealing" ideas from other sources are fine, I don't read, watch TV, or hit the news to a great extent. That said, my focus is not necessarily in gaming when I do those activities, so it is rare that I get an idea from those sources. The books I read are usually computer reference books, and similar with news.

Steenan, is this what you mean by Dungeon World? http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/product/108028/Dungeon-World

TreChriron, I do have Red Tide and Stars Without Number, but I only glimpsed it. Wasn't sure I understood how the book worked.

JackOfAllTrades, I do not believe that I saw that list in my searches. I spent a lot of time on that site but mostly used what I found to search out somewhere else.

JHull does kind of hit what I am looking for in his last paragraph. Years of playing have left the games we play a little stagnant. In fact, we played on campaign 4 times because we "didn't get it right" (my words, not the DM). I want to throw a little more depth into the game, a hard sell I'm sure.

I have no issue using store bought adventures. The issue that I'm running into is where to go from there? An adventure path is fine, but it can suffer from the "the PCs will eventually go off track/screw something up." Which is fine, but it requires coming up with an idea to get them back "on track". While individual modules have the issue of "where do we go from here" to fit to the next adventure. Finally, if the next adventure is off in left field compared to where you want to go, it helps having the ability to plot out a new direction.

As a current example, I'm going to run Lost Mine of Phandelver when the current DM is finished. I can think of encounters to introduce them to the adventure (it's a little "here you go" to begin), but the rewards granted don't translate well to another adventure (I'll keep it spoiler free).

So, in the end, stealing is good, but improvising is key as well.

Again, I appreciate the help and I'm still interested in additional input.

Thanks!

 

[Rune]

I somewhat disagree that the DM doesn't create the story. True, the Players create the story, but the story wouldn't exist without the DM. I feel that it's up to the DM to create the backbone and let the players flesh it out. The story wouldn't exist without the DM.

I think it might be helpful to tweak your perception just a touch. If you view the DM's role not as providing the core of the story, but as providing the ingredients for the players' to craft the story, you will find that a lot of the burden you have placed on yourself can be shed.

 

[Wicht]

I have no issue using store bought adventures. The issue that I'm running into is where to go from there? An adventure path is fine, but it can suffer from the "the PCs will eventually go off track/screw something up." Which is fine, but it requires coming up with an idea to get them back "on track". While individual modules have the issue of "where do we go from here" to fit to the next adventure. Finally, if the next adventure is off in left field compared to where you want to go, it helps having the ability to plot out a new direction.

I'll let you in on a secret that is normally only given to DMs who have achieved at least 9th level, but since you did ask for help...

The real secret to successful DMing is not in being able to create the adventure. Its in creating a situation wherein your players do exactly what you want them to do anyway, but think that its entirely their own idea that they did it.

 

[Grainger]

I think it's been mentioned above to "start small". A good, time-honoured way to do this is just to have the PCs venture to the "caves near town", just because they want to loot them, or because someone has been kidnapped and taken there, etc. You can then have a simple (small) dungeon adventure to get things rolling.

What next? This little jaunt could lead to them discovering evidence that the PCs' village/town is under threat... maybe a group of (intelligent) monsters in the cave was part of an larger group, and there's a wider plan. So how will the PCs deal with this (will they get help from elsewhere? defend the settlement themselves? how?). You can expand the scope from there - these local heroes, now they've got a rep, could be hired by someone from a bigger town. Or perhaps the enemies they defeated have wider designs that the PCs might want to thwart.

This is just one way of doing it, but it lets you start small - you just sketch out the settlement they live in, and some caves - and then widen the world as the campaign scope expands. There's a reason D&D traditionally follows a "zero to hero" curve - the DM can design the game world as the PCs widen their horizons.

Of course, you don't have to do it like that. You could design the overall world (or at least the country they live in) first. But if you're nervous about designing a world from the top down, then the "ever widening scope" approach, starting with just a small town or village, is a good one.

 

[steenan]

Steenan, is this what you mean by Dungeon World? http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/product/108028/Dungeon-World

Yes, that's it.
There's also a freely available Dungeon World Guide, for example here: http://www.curufea.com/lib/exe/fetc...ng:dw:dungeon_world_guide_pdf_version_1.2.pdf. It's not a sourcebook, but a fan-written guide, a set of explanations and examples. It's really worth reading.

 

[MichaelSomething]

Like in many situations, there's a book to help with that... try the Ultimate Toolbox! http://www.alderac.com/ultimatetoolbox/

 

[NewJeffCT]

I used to DM all the time when I was younger, then took a break from D&D for a few years as my original gaming group graduated college and moved out of Connecticut to other environs. When I got back into gaming, I was part of a group that had a fantastic full time DM, so was happily a player for a few years. However, some job changes and a move for me, and the fantastic DM becoming permanently handicapped kept me out of gaming for a few more years - until I got a chance with a new group with me as DM. So, I was a bit rusty. Plus, my job is in accounting & financial analysis, so I'm pretty analytical as well.

What I did was plan out just the first adventure using a published low level adventure that was somewhat open ended in that it had a timeline of events that happened in game rather than a linear progression of encounters leading up to the conclusion. I had that, plus I had a few loose ideas for where the game could go once we finished up that starter adventure, but I did not want to commit to anything in case it all fell apart.

Well, I ran the players through that starter adventure and the group picked up 2 more players along the way (a soon to be married couple). I thought I integrated them into the game pretty smoothly and they were there for the climax of that low level adventure, an encounter with slavers. Then, since that final encounter was with slavers, one of the original PCs decided that he was inspired by the fight against slavery and would become a Paladin of Freedom and dedicate himself to the anti-slavery deity. From there, one of those "loose ideas" suddenly surged to the forefront in the PCs (all good aligned) challenging the masters of the slavers of that first encounter - the lawful evil deity of slavery and tyranny, who ran an oppressive theocracy across the border. And, I also picked up a new player as well.

So, while I was fleshing out the long term goals of the campaign and what it would build to from there, I basically ran a mini adventure I created on my own that I could probably call "The Slavers Strike Back" - the few slavers that escaped managed to get together a more powerful force of allies and then attempted to strike back at the PCs and a few of their key allies (a dryad, a pseudodragon and a few brownies) that ended with a huge encounter/showdown. So, creating this mini adventure (run over 5-6 sessions maybe?) gave me additional time to flesh out the long term stuff, but also increased the PCs' hatred of slavers, since it was the slavers that were striking back and attempting to kill/capture their allies.

By the time that The Slavers Strike Back was done, the group has really come together well and everybody was united in their hatred of the followers of this deity of slavery and tyranny. From there, it was just a matter of grabbing ideas from different published adventures that I thought suited the campaign and pointing the PCs in the right direction. Not everything went smoothly every time out, but there were a lot of memorable encounters and moments along the way with the climax underneath the great temple of this deity of slavery & tyranny. Plus, I picked up two more players for a grand total of 8 (the soon to be fiancee of one player, and the teenage son of another, so I couldn't exactly turn them down...) For each encounter along the way, I would probably over-prepare (putting the "anal" in analysis) for each one to compensate for having such a large group, but I became really good at challenging the PCs down to their last hit points and last spells/powers. I wasn't always good at thinking on my feet, but I got better along the way.

So, don't overdo it to start. It worked out great for me to run a published adventure to start and have a few ideas for longer term that kind of took care of themselves once that published adventure was completed.

 

[edhel]

I see DMing as a two-part problem. Firstly you have to come up with a premise for a story/adventure, and secondly you have to be an improvisational storyteller and be able to describe things to your players in a compelling manner and react to what they are doing.

This is my old advice for another person http://www.enworld.org/forum/showth...ing-Dungeons-HELP/page2&p=6356202#post6356202
but let me rephrase it here:
1) Don't make assumptions about player actions. Only create an understandable premise (possibly with a couple of twists) and let action happen. Let actions have consequences. It will sort itself out.
2) Let your antagonists be human in motivation and ability. They don't know everything even though they might be smart and prepared. They will react to your players' interference but they have limited resources and have to rely on other people.
3) If you have difficulty in the storytelling part, read authors you like and analyze how they do what they do. I personally like a terse style. I found Chris Perkins' articles about Stephen King useful: The Storytelling King & Stephen King's Third Eye
4) Involve your players in the creation process. You don't have to do it all alone. Let them create their characters' religions, their families etc.
5) Don't get too attached to your ideas, and prepare to improvise. Collect helpful tables. I have DMing "scrapbook" filled with stuff I've found interesting and helpful.
6) If you still feel intimidated, limit your first adventures physically to a village or a dungeon, or some other manageable chuck.

 

[Janx]

I don't really have a resource for that, because it isn't how the best campaigns (IMHO) are created. You, the DM, don't create a story.

Create antagonists. The antagonists are people - they have personalities. They have goals. They set about heir goals.

The PCs are the protagonists. They act against the antagonists. That interaction *creates* the story.

Later on, you learn how to find the PCs foibles, and to yank their chains in ways that are thematically appropriate, to enhance things.

This is a good start.

The OP specifically said he's not creative. Even referenced that's he's very analytical.

I would not want to play in a "story" game with a GM who's not good at making up a story. It's why PirateCat has a good rep as a GM for that kind of thing.

What I would advise for the OP, and this is part of what Umbran's saying, is to try running a Sandbox style game.

I'm not an advocate of Sandbox RPGing, so bear with me if I don't represent it well.

Sandbox GMing works by setting up all the elements Umbran describes. People and places. Use random generators for the bulk of it if need be.

Then, you set the players in it and react to what they want to do. You analyze what they've done (or want to do) and make the NPCs react accordingly or force a pertinent NPC's path to cross a PC so they can meet and trigger some more reactions.

It's less "creative" and more "what would happen next"

In this way, you aren't trying to force a story on the players, you are just making the game world move and respond to player stimulus.

Which might be more in tune with the OP's non-creative, analytical nature.

 

[PnPgamer]

My dm said that he will think about start and end, and the wvents in between.

For example
Start) players start out in tavern when fireball explodes the tavern inside out.
Event A) a hippogriff riders aid is needed for pcs to accomplish thing x
Event B) luring a kraken into the harbour benefits players to accomplish thing y
Ending) after pcs have done x,y,z and gamma, they can now fight the BBEG on (more) equal terms.

He then twines events into each other and creates a path from start to end, visiting (most) events in between.