WotC Dungeons & Dragons Fans Seek Removal of Oriental Adventures From Online Marketplace

[Chaosmancer]

And who is the "European Communities"? And when do we get to the point when it changes from being one or two guys complaining to the net to the whole culture has spoken?

Also I am pretty sure the link you posted is illegal.

Don't know if it is illegal, but I removed it. The point still stands though, if people are concerned with mass access for historical importance. That is already a thing. Communities have been building up online libraries for a long time.

And, I don't know who the "European communities" are. But, if they feel they've been mistreated and misrepresented, then they can band together and ask for changes.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

Sadly this truism, is just not true...at least not in the realm of ideas.
The more an idea is repeated, the more it is believed and accepted.
Sadly, this seems to apply Even when falsehoods are stated in circumstances that should emphasize the ridiculousness of the position.

A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.

I appreciate your long and thoughtful post; just know that while I think that our current situation is ... not always hopeful, I trust that the truth, once it gets its pants on, eventually will catch up, and that while the downside of lying is easy to see and quantify, the downside of suppression has a dark history as well and usually comes cloaked with good intentions (because no one believes themselves the villain of a piece).

 

[Seramus]

This is the same stupid argument made by the pro-confederate statues people. Getting rid of something that is offensive isn't "erasing history", it's just admitting you did something/portrayed something in an offensive manner, and apologizing for it.

Alternatively, it's a perfectly fine argument. My grandma is racist and I'm always going to call her out on it when she says those things, but I'm not going to force her be quiet.

 

[Cadence]

So because you live in Boston, and your library system (with 26 libraries) has a single copy ... for in library use only and that is not on the shelves ... of the book, every person that is not so fortunate doesn't need to be considered?

It's killing me that inter-library loan isn't back up and running at the local University yet (and that our public system has a much more restricted range). Anyway, once the world is open again it's worth checking out for everyone who can't find things in their own library.

Oriental adventures | WorldCat.org

Oriental adventures | WorldCat.org

www.worldcat.org

Advanced dungeons & dragons - Oriental adventures | WorldCat.org

Advanced dungeons & dragons - Oriental adventures | WorldCat.org

www.worldcat.org

 

[Levistus's_Leviathan]

There. Are. Entire. Books. Written. About. The. History. Of. D&D.

Okay, then. How is this destroying history? It isn't. Sure, in those books about the history of D&D, there'll be a mention of the time when WotC wanted to make the game less offensive and more open. I fail to see how this destroys history.

Your inability to understand different perspectives does not mean you are correct, and your use of charged and inflammatory analogies to tar people as racists is offensive.

My inability to see different perspectives? I'm sorry if I'm unwilling to see the side of those who use logical fallacies left and right. I'm not tarring anyone. I'm not an angry mob wanting to destroy D&D. I'm merely pointing out how certain arguments are less than correct.

There is a valid debate to be had about proper corrective actions to take; I will always side on the maximalist side of promotion of ideas and access to material, even while agreeing that it is offensive. I will not have this debate with someone who immediately invokes that analogy.

There is a debate to be had about that, but not while using slippery slope and erasing history fallacies. Nice to hear you say that you will literally not compromise or see other points of view. You just admitted that you want to debate without being open to any change of opinion.

 

[Bagpuss]

Okay, I'm on page two of this thread so maybe this gets addressed, but did people miss the part of the article that pointed out the bigger issue was that they took 3 or 4 cultures, mixed them together, then presented them as a single unit full of stereotypes?

Oh you mean like D&D with European history previously, where you can face monsters from Greek myths others from Russian or Scandinavian traditions, have Arthurian style chivalry type Paladins with Viking like Berserkers? Yeah not seeing that as an issue.

 

[Cadence]

So I checked and there are 9 5e Monster Manuals in the system, none for any other edition. Its funny, I checked out a 3e MM II about a decade or so ago, must have been purged at some point.

It probably wore out. A life of circulation can be hard on books, particularly popular ones.

Most libraries purge books a lot if they aren't checked out. I sometimes wonder how bad I am for once in a while checking out some by my favorite authors just so I can return them to keep them on the shelves :-/

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

You just admitted that you want to debate without being open to any change of opinion.

No. What I said is I don't want to converse ... with you. I apologize if that was, in any way, unclear.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Oh you mean like D&D with European history previously, where you can face monsters from Greek myths others from Russian or Scandinavian traditions, have Arthurian style chivalry type Paladins with Viking like Berserkers? Yeah not seeing that as an issue.

You know, no one ever felt the need to bring up how racist Faerun and all their European views are until we started pointing out that the OA was problematic for people.

But, if it leads to the game being more inclusive and less hurtful to the greeks for the use of their hydra, then I guess we can talk about changing that after we change the OA

 

[Guest 6801328]

There. Are. Entire. Books. Written. About. The. History. Of. D&D.

Oh? Is someone arguing that those books need to be banned/burned? I must have missed that podcast.