D&D General why do we have halflings and gnomes?

[Maxperson]

It don't hint to an ascpet that many here don't like to admit.

That Halflings in some popular settings are completely dependent on the "big folk" due to them lacking a nobility, a military society, or a magic tradition.
That's how it works in FR..
How it works in Greyhawk.
How it works in Warhammer.

I'm not sure I agree about FR. I don't know about Greyhawk and Warhammer.

How it works even in Middle Earth.

This is completely wrong, though. The Hobbits lived in uncontested area and were pretty much unknown to the Humans outside of the Dunedain and Bree. They aren't dependent on anyone else and defended their home from an orc invasion with no help, the one time it happened.

 

[Minigiant]

This is completely wrong, though. The Hobbits lived in uncontested area and were pretty much unknown to the Humans outside of the Dunedain and Bree. They aren't dependent on anyone else and defended their home from an orc invasion with no help, the one time it happened.

Because the men of Bree and Dunedain declined. Men were protecting hobbits the whole time until they couldn't

 

[Maxperson]

Because the men of Bree and Dunedain declined. Men were protecting hobbits the whole time until they couldn't

No. The men of Bree were a town without enough people to have a chance to win against the Hobbits. If they would have attacked, they would have lost. The Dunedain didn't have the numbers.

 

[FrozenNorth]

I'm honestly not sure who the "Shire-pushers" would even be. There are those defending that shires could be fine, and there are those saying that shires are not fine. I'm not sure either side is committed to "shires or nothing".

The way I see it, both the default PHB lore and MToF indicate that halflings live in shires (though it also suggests that some are nomadic).

No one is saying “only shires” or “no shires at all”. What they are saying is that the shires, as portrayed in PHB and MToF are unrealistic, given how the other races are portrayed.

 

[Oofta]

The way I see it, both the default PHB lore and MToF indicate that halflings live in shires (though it also suggests that some are nomadic).

No one is saying “only shires” or “no shires at all”. What they are saying is that the shires, as portrayed in PHB and MToF are unrealistic, given how the other races are portrayed.

The problem I have with shires being "unrealistic" is that if they are unrealistic then so are most human dominated rural farming villages are unrealistic well. Take a look at maps from modules. Most have no walls, even towns like Phandalin that is specifically set in the frontier.

Admittedly, halflings aren't elves or dwarves. Neither are all the races that are not elves or dwarves.

 

[Maxperson]

No one is saying “only shires” or “no shires at all”. What they are saying is that the shires, as portrayed in PHB and MToF are unrealistic, given how the other races are portrayed.

And that's the problem. How the other races are portrayed is not relevant to whether or not Halflings are realistic. Races differ from one another.

 

[Chaosmancer]

It's once every several generations for a race that lives on average to 150. Multiple generations, not one. I was assuming a generation was 50 years because of the lifespan. None of the lore really explains when they start having families so it's just what I would do for my home campaign.

There's no reason for halflings to not use weapons, the book doesn't forbid it. As with most races it doesn't really go into it. The same way that commoners of all races will use the best weapon available not just the stick clubs listed in the MM. There's also no reason they wouldn't have guards, veterans and so on although with 100 people or less it's not particularly likely.

PHB tells us they reach adulthood in their 20's, so still on a more human scale for generations. Multiple would still be closer to 40 or 60 years, not a hundred.

Also, that part I bolded and underlined? That they should have guards and veterans and so on? That was my point. They should be added into the community. It was then you and others who declared that I was wrong and that they didn't have such things because they were completely safe and not, how was it phrased just recently? "Militant naughty words?" Who would have things like guards in their villages.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Who says the monarchy asks?

Every definition of Monarchy ever conceived? Though, I suppose "asks" is very generous phrasing when it is usually more "demands". You have no leg to stand on to try and tell me that halflings, who do trade, so would have contact with their neighbors, would be exempt from government taxation.

That is Cormyr's land, and they are getting their taxes from it.

 

[Oofta]

PHB tells us they reach adulthood in their 20's, so still on a more human scale for generations. Multiple would still be closer to 40 or 60 years, not a hundred.

Also, that part I bolded and underlined? That they should have guards and veterans and so on? That was my point. They should be added into the community. It was then you and others who declared that I was wrong and that they didn't have such things because they were completely safe and not, how was it phrased just recently? "Militant naughty words?" Who would have things like guards in their villages.

None of the racial write-ups discuss percentage of NPCs in a specific community are anything other than commoners. You're holding the halflings to a higher standard.

 

[Chaosmancer]

The problem I have with shires being "unrealistic" is that if they are unrealistic then so are most human dominated rural farming villages are unrealistic well. Take a look at maps from modules. Most have no walls, even towns like Phandalin that is specifically set in the frontier.

Admittedly, halflings aren't elves or dwarves. Neither are all the races that are not elves or dwarves.

Except that even a human village generally has a Lord who is in charge of their defense. Or they have connections with a stronger military power and authority.

Or, like Phandolin, they are overrun by other interests within a few years and propped up as a smokescreen. As I showed in the timeline, the same year Phandolin was "well established" after a joint venture of two stronger city-states, it was subverted by the Drow backed Red Brands and surrounded by Goblins and Orcs.

Now, I'll admit, the fact that they Red Brands were working for Glasstaff who was supposed to be the constable of Phandalin means that having a wall or guards wouldn't have done much good. Corruption can't be stopped by walls, but I think it really shows why I keep insisting that the world is dangerous enough to warrant those defenses.