D&D General No More "Humans in Funny Hats": Racial Mechanics Should Determine Racial Cultures

Minigiant

Legend
Supporter
Their favourite music! Why didn't I think of that?

Is there anything more 'Fey' than a Magical Land of Sound and Lights filled with Entertainment and Food where you "lose track of time"?! Casinos are Feywild AF.

I'm surprised this isn't an angle taken for Elves somewhere? Elves are way too often just Fantasy Vulcans...
The high elven capitol in the setting I'm setting up is kinda Vegasy as the high elven noble families and royalty branches try to outdo each other in castle design and lawn entertainment out of sheer spite, jealousy, and boredom under a sky that ever-dusk sky of silent fireworks.

You know, if you can live to 600-700 years old, are naturally dexterous, don't really sleep, and have heightened senses, your entertainment needs will have to be over the top to trigger that elf-dopamine drip into the brain once the elves became "mortal".
 

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Steampunkette

Rules Tinkerer and Freelance Writer
Supporter
I think you're misunderstanding the difference between generic and flavored, or else using a different definition than most of us. Because this:


is generic. The only "flavor" comes from its Lawful alignment and what you interpret based on its traits. You can ignore the world-specific flavor provided by Theros or Ravnica, but the minotaurs of those worlds are still "generic." It's traits are entirely centered on it being a Big Bull-Headed Dude. You can stick that minotaur anywhere and not worry about its stats.

Now, compare to something like hobgoblins, which have a bunch of military traits baked in: some martial training and the Saving Face trait. This is specific, because it revolves around the idea of hobbos being highly militarized. It's probably one reason why they made the "fey hobgoblin" race.

When we are saying "generic," we don't mean flavorless. We mean "not built for a specific concept or setting."
Oh... In that case...

There's really nothing "Generic" or "Bland" whatsoever. There's only "This Flavor" or "That Flavor". And creators deciding to reflavor things to fit what they want, or use them whole cloth.

And this entire tangent is just... pointless.

Though it should be noted? There is more to the term "Minotaur" than combat attributes and a Lawful Alignment or it's pointed horns. Things like:

1) Associations with Strength, Size, Virility
2) Associations with Ancient History
3) Associations with Bestial Natures and Crudity
4) Associations with Mystical Origins

And more... All of those things I'm carrying over to Project Chronicle. These are the flavors that I need more than "Lawful" or "Likes Mazes".

And no amount of Crunch can really reflect those things. Meanwhile I could structure a Hobgoblin Society in a militaristic manner without giving all Hobgoblins that Crunch. So... y'know...

It's a big complex mess.
 


doctorbadwolf

Heretic of The Seventh Circle
Fair enough! the Minbari in Babylon 5 traditionally use a bed at an inclined because of my aforementioned 'laying down means you are dead' thing.
God I wish Babylon 5 could get a good remastered release. I'd almost support a reboot but...I'd be very worried about it lol
 




Levistus's_Leviathan

5e Freelancer
I'm going to poke holes in your examples a bit.
Sure thing! I (literally) was asking for it in the OP!
The reason those three races so that is because they have a unique innate fantastical quality to them. They are shapechangers, living golems and innately psionic people. They have an obvious hook. The farther you get from human, the easier the hook. Aarakroca and tabaxi are easier to design a culture around than halflings or gnomes because the former have a unique element (mimicking an animal's behavior) and the latter not much beyond "short and quirky".
Okay, we're getting back to the Halfling thread a bit here, and I don't want this thread to become another Halfling thread (we all know what the result of those are . . .), so I'm going to steer this around a bit.

Why can't halflings, gnomes, and other races/lineages that traditionally/stereotypically are just "short and quirky" be more different from humans? Why can't there be just a bit more non-human flavor added onto these races (or just leaned into more than before)??? If Halflings are "the best farmers to ever farm, and nearly magically-so" and "the happiest people to ever be a people since the Scandinavians, and possibly law-required to be happy", that gives them a bit more flavor that separates them culturally from humans, and in unique and interesting ways.

Sure, it's more difficult to differentiate the more human-like races from humans in culture and behavior than it is for animal-folk and golem-people/psionic-people/shapechangers/undead-touched, but it's not impossible, it just takes a bit more work.
That magical element is much more interesting if expanded on; when eladrin were a Core race, there was a lot of discussion about what things would look like if you had a race that could teleport every 5 minutes. Would they need ladders and stairs? What would their prisons look like? The obvious magical hook is easier to create something unique, compared to the rather stock blandness of dwarves, elves and orcs.
And that's cool. You're right. It is easier to differentiate magical races culturally from humans than it is for nonmagical ones to differentiate from humans. However, it's not impossible. It's easier to think of problems that races that can teleport or fly would have in human society than it is for ones that don't have those features, but it's not impossible, and IMHO, it's well worth the work.
Second, I noticed you left out the fourth Eberron race: shifter. My guess is that their culture isn't as focused on their shifting and for the most part could be replicated with another race that is rural/tribal, has a reputation for violence and infatuation with the moon.
That, and the fact that I've never found Shifters to be that compelling or Eberron specific (well, changelings aren't as Eberron-specific either, but shifters are even less so, IMO). Shifters are tied to the Eldeen Reaches, the Lycanthrope Purge, and Lammania the Twilight Forest, but IMHO, they're not as well-built in culture as the other 3 Eberron races.

If their culture was focused on shifting (which is fairly difficult, as the different subraces have vastly different shifting abilities, and shifting is limited in use), IMO, they'd be more compelling in this area. If they were more tied with Lycanthropes (similarly to how Hexblood are tied to Hags and Genasi are tied to Genies), they'd also be more culturally compelling. However, they aren't, so I didn't feel the need to mention them as an example (and are largely why I made it clear that Eberron is "fairly/relatively successful" in replicating what I detailed in the OP, and isn't perfect in that regard).
The last reason why these three races so this is they are tied to a specific setting, rather than being generic enough to go on any setting. Warforged culture works because the Last War, the Cannith creation forges, the Lord of Blades, the Treaty of Thronehold, etc. Strip all that out and your get "generic robot" PC race. As a better example, read the fluff on 4e's tieflings and dragonborn built for Nerath vs the generic muck in the 5e PHB.
I agree that this aspect of the races helps, but I disagree that it's that setting specific. Changelings are tied to Eberron, but their cultural aspects that depend on their shapeshifting would work in nearly any world. Shifters are also tied to Eberron, but if they were transplanted into a Domain of Dread from Ravenloft, leaning heavily into the "Lycanthrope-person race" idea, they could have a very interesting culture based on their mechanical identity (similarly to how Dhampir are treated in Ravenloft).
So I think your idea is an interesting one, but for it to work, you'd need a fixed default setting to make the races work and/or clear fantastic hooks to base the cultures around. Attempts to do the opposite (generic elves suitable for any setting or homebrew) would create races no better than humans in masks.
I disagree that you'd need a fixed default setting (or at least, that it'd need more of a fixed default/base setting than 5e already has). Elven longevity has huge cultural impacts, regardless of the world. How the world treats those impacts are where things differ, from how Eberron has them extremely afraid of death compared to other worlds' representations of this aspect of elven culture. Dwarves in 5e Eberron are tied to the typical aspects of D&D Dwarves (I am a dwarf, and I'm digging a hole. Diggy, diggy hole. Diggy, diggy hole), but are also deeply tied into an aspect of Eberron's world (the Daelkyr being trapped inside Khyber, and creating symbiotic magic items). You can have base racial cultures that depend on their racial features, but that also differ vastly between worlds.
 

Tonguez

A suffusion of yellow
Oh... In that case...

There's really nothing "Generic" or "Bland" whatsoever. There's only "This Flavor" or "That Flavor". And creators deciding to reflavor things to fit what they want, or use them whole cloth.

And this entire tangent is just... pointless.

Though it should be noted? There is more to the term "Minotaur" than combat attributes and a Lawful Alignment or it's pointed horns. Things like:

1) Associations with Strength, Size, Virility
2) Associations with Ancient History
3) Associations with Bestial Natures and Crudity
4) Associations with Mystical Origins

And more... All of those things I'm carrying over to Project Chronicle. These are the flavors that I need more than "Lawful" or "Likes Mazes"..

But those four traits could equally apply to Ogre or Saurian or Leonine or Loxodon, so whats the real beefy flavour of Minotaur that make it stand out from other big, virile, bestial creatures with mystical origins?
 

Levistus's_Leviathan

5e Freelancer
Can I just put this as an aside:

WHY does everything ALWAYS have to justify its existence with you people?! Justify this class, justify this race... Why can't something just be cool and fun mechanics with a nice name on top and a little fluff?! Why is everything always this whole song and dance?! It gets exhausting!
I'm not very fond of the "you people" here, but perhaps I can explain how many that feel that options should have justifications feel.

To put it bluntly (and fairly extremely): If a race/class/whatever-part-of-D&D doesn't justify it's existence, it may as well not exist. If a race acts like a human (diet, culture, language, etc) and looks like a human (more or less), it may as well just be a human. It doesn't matter if they have rainbow hair, green skin, or are covered head-to-toe in shaggy hair, they may as well just be a human. Sure, real world humans can't naturally have rainbow hair or green skin, but that doesn't matter in a fantasy world, where literally anything is possible.

However, if there is something else to further differentiate the races - maybe the rainbow-haired race is actually a subrace of Aasimar that are descended from Unicorns, or the green-skinned race are actually photosynthetic and have a bond with nature (probably being dryads), and the overly-hairy people are actually Bugbears - then that helps "justify" their existence.

Sure, this isn't needed. It's a perfectly fine and valid way of playing D&D by having 70 different races for humans that act like humans and look like humans in everything but minor cosmetic differences (unnatural skin/hair/eye color, hair on unnatural parts of the body, language, minor mechanical differences (like size), etc), but that's not what many people prefer in their games. I like my world-building and homebrewing to be more in-depth than "another human race, but with purple skin" or "a homebrew class with innate arcane magic (like the Sorcerer), but it's a Half-Caster". I'd be fine with an Arcane-Half-Caster similar in theme to the Sorcerer, or a race of people that look like Humans but with Purple Skin, but there has to be more to them than just those minor differences (Felshen in my world often have vibrant purple skin and other multicolored skin tones, like cyan, cream-orange, turquoise, and so on, and their psionic nature sets them apart from just being "multicolored humans").

The same also applies to creating new animal races. If Lizardfolk already exist, I don't need Crocodilefolk (Lizardfolk mechanics already work perfectly for crocodile people), Dinosaur-People, or Tuatarafolk. If Grung are playable, I don't need playable Grippli, Bullywugs, or Toadfolk (okay, I will admit that having one broader frog/toad-folk race with subraces for Poisonous Frogs, Toadfolk, and Wolverine=frogfolk would be cool). If Aarakocra are playable, I don't need different races for Hawkfolk, Eaglefolk, and Falconfolk. If Tabaxi and Leonin are playable, I don't need Jaguarfolk, Tigerfolk, and Ocelotfolk. (There are some animals that do deserve their own separate races, even though the concepts have some overlap, like Owlfolk and Aarakocra, Leonin and Tabaxi, Lizardfolk and Dragonborn, etc, but there is a line that has to be drawn to avoid crazy explosions of every different "animalfolk" variety of different types of birds, reptiles, and mammals.)
Anyway...

Elves and their relatives do not sleep. They trance. That means they probably don't have bedrooms and beds (trance chairs maybe?), and like the Minbari of Babylon 5, they probably see 'laying down' as a thing dead people do. They're probably creeped out by other folks sleeping and the concept of dreams must sound insane to them. They probably have a way different daily schedule compared to races that need lengthy sleep and coupled with darkvision might have activities that goes on 24/7 in different shifts. This also means you can walk into a Elven settlement at any time of the day or night and find random activities going on that you wouldn't associate with that specific time: day drinking revellers, kids playing in the street at night, classes etc. No proper bedroom and beds would probably also impact reproductive "activity" (Elven Kama Sutra?) compared to what we normally do.

This 24/7 culture, added to their long lives, might blend into a loose sense of scheduling where things happen when they need to happen, not because of a traditional schedule. They probably find the concept of specific meals for specific time of days to be quite funny. Pancakes were not invented by Elves. Add their mystical connection to nature and they probably always harvest at the perfect time without needing to really schedule it. I can see an Elf farmer getting up from a discussion at 1 AM and going "Well, time to harvest the apples!" simply because they 'heard' them be ready.
And I absolutely love stuff like this! It makes Elves seem unique and cool, and also helps inspire how to roleplay an elf (for both DMs and Players) differently from humans! The "I don't need to sleep, so my race is Diurnal" is an awesome hook for a reason to roleplay an elf! This is kind of thing is exactly what I'm asking to be more common in D&D races! This isn't even setting-specific, although it's specific to the elven race!

Dwarves have a low center of mass and they live underground, so they sleep standing up, Forest Gnomes are friends with nature fey and small animals that can alert them if enemies arrive, so they just take naps in the middle of the forest, curled up with a blanket of moss, and stuff like this creates a lot of really fun and interesting bits and pieces of the races that you can use to further differentiate one from another. Humans can't be as diurnal as elves. They (typically) can't sleep while standing up. They can't just face-plant out in the middle of a grove without fear of pests or predators disturbing them. These kind of things help give the races more unique identities, and are exactly the reason why I created this thread!
 

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