D&D 5E Don't Throw 5e Away Because of Hasbro

[Ulorian - Agent of Chaos]

and this is where you are losing me. Are you prepared for the zombie apocalypse, an alien invasion, world war 3, the mafia getting an interest in you and starting to shake you down?

You prepare for the likely issues, not for literally anything, and you have every right to complain.

That was reductionist, and beneath you frankly. Alien invasions? Come on...

 

[mamba]

I understand that. But I also understand that any agreement entered into which states 'this will never change, regardless of whatever future circumstances arise' is a trap. If you agreed to this, you did so foolishly.

or I did so trusting in them understanding the benefits to both sides (this is why they are offering it after all) and the fact that the wording is strong enough to not be questioned.

Are you suggesting that anyone using the CC SRD is also foolish to trust in it being irrevocable?

 

[Ulorian - Agent of Chaos]

or I did so trusting in them understanding the benefits to both sides (this is why they are offering it after all) and the fact that the wording is string enough to not be questioned.

Are you suggesting that anyone using the CC SRD is also foolish to trust in it being irrevocable?

Could you go back and read my recent posts on this topic? I feel like you are trying to manufacture some anger here instead of trying to understand and discuss what's actually at stake.

 

[Ulorian - Agent of Chaos]

Are you suggesting that anyone using the CC SRD is also foolish to trust in it being irrevocable?

The wording gives so much lenience to one side that it's inevitable that at some point in time the other side is going to question this agreement. Whether the future argument is right or wrong on its face, that lenience is going to be questioned. It's why the US constitution has amendments.

 

[mamba]

Could you go back and read my recent posts on this topic?

you said any perpetual agreement is a trap and that the OGL being a trap is something licensees should have been prepared for.

But I also understand that any agreement entered into which states 'this will never change, regardless of whatever future circumstances arise' is a trap. If you agreed to this, you did so foolishly. If you wrote the agreement, you set that trap, whether that was intentional or not. If you, as the signee, agree to something like this, be prepared to have this challenged in the future.

The CC is perpetual as well, just like the OGL. So by your logic it too is a trap and I should be prepared that it gets challenged in the future. So if I could not afford to defend against a challenge to the OGL by a billion dollar company, should I then sign on to the CC with that same company?

I feel like you are trying to manufacture some anger here instead of trying to understand and discuss what's actually at stake.

I am not interested in manufacturing anger, doesn’t mean that WotC’s actions sit well with me or I just shrug them off with an ‘oh well, people should have seen this coming and planned for it, they have nothing to complain about’

 

[mamba]

That was reductionist, and beneath you frankly. Alien invasions? Come on...

I tried going from least likely to most likely while keeping them all on the ‘so unlikely, you do not really prepare for it’ side, with the possible exception of the last one

Doesn’t change the argument, there are many unlikely things you do not really prepare for, and you have every right to complain about things, regardless of whether you prepared for them or not

I do not really understand your ‘prepare for everything and when it comes true, grin and bear it, but do not bother me with your troubles by complaining’ attitude

 

[Ulorian - Agent of Chaos]

I do not really understand your ‘prepare for everything and when it comes true, grin and bear it, but do not bother me with your troubles by complaining’ attitude

You are conflating two disparate things: dealing with a real world problem and feeling compassion for those affected by that real world problem. You make things better for those affected by recognising the details and intricacies of the problem then dealing with it, not sitting around complaining about said problem. This is actual compassion in my view: making real attempts to make things better for those who have things worse. Noticing that there is a problem and complaining about it is easy. Getting something done about it takes a bit more effort than that.

 

[Zardnaar]

You are conflating two disparate things: dealing with a real world problem and feeling compassion for those affected by that real world problem. You make things better for those affected by recognising the details and intricacies of the problem then dealing with it, not sitting around complaining about said problem. This is actual compassion in my view: making real attempts to make things better for those who have things worse. Noticing that there is a problem and complaining about it is easy. Getting something done about it takes a bit more effort than that.

In hindsight for WotC the OGL may have been a mistake. Never tge less they created it and its legally binding.

I wouldn't be 100% convinced it's irrevocable until it's tested in court. IANAL.

But until that day comes......

If they want to get rid of it indirectly they need to create a product that isn't OGL and is do good an OGL product can't compete.

They might get something like that with Beyond. 5E won't last forever even if technically it can.

 

[SlyFlourish]

I am no longer working on 5e projects because I won't give any more support to a system that reinforces a dnd-only monoculture

Is Level Up A5e and Tales of the Valiant in that monoculture? Flee Mortals? These weee big projects that lots of people enjoyed. Them being small next to D&D doesn’t mean they’re not loved and valued by many.

 

[SlyFlourish]

What the late period of this thread has taught me is that there are people who won't buy or play Kobold Press/MCDM/EN Pub/etc works because since they are 5e they still support WotC, despite that being absolutely untrue

Yes. This makes me sad and is the reason I wrote this post.