D&D General Combat as War vs. Sport and a Missing Third Mode

[zakael19]

However, it also may be its own style that exists independently of the other two, and that is what this thread is about.

My mind is of course going to keep going to DH since it's what I'm running a lot of right now, and it has phrases like "collaborate at all times, especially during conflict" and "They’re the opponents of the adversaries you play, but you and the players are on the same side: the side invested in telling an amazing story together. When representing antagonists and challenges, your main job is to balance presenting credible threats with maintaining the trust of the players so that the collaborative process can succeed."

I dont think combat as sport is particularly concerned with that.

 

[Minigiant]

Once? Half of this thread is about Pro Wrestling. My point is that the pro wrestling discussion is a distraction. And now you've got me perpetuating that distraction, Pelor help us...

It wasnt a distraction.
It was me.

Me trying to inform that Theater is mostly just the show.

But Pro Wrestling is the show, the show before the show, the show after the show, the entrances and exits, and the promotion.

Daggerheart's Hope and Fear & Draw Steel's Recoveries and Victories persisting between battles is CaPW.

Its not just Wrestlemania. It the Road to Wrestlemania of Royal Rumble, Elimination Chamber, and all the shows in-between.

Its not just being the smug fancy clothes wearing heel champion. It's beating all his minions, mercenaries, and heaters in dramatic fights to build up the final fight.

CaT to me feels more about making every scene theatrical.

CaPW to me feels more about hitting the spots and appearance to call back to the past, deliver the expected present, and promote the future. And that's through a form of real or imagined metacurrency.

 

[GobHag]

It wasnt a distraction.
It was me.

Me trying to inform that Theater is mostly just the show.

But Pro Wrestling is the show, the show before the show, the show after the show, the entrances and exits, and the promotion.

Daggerheart's Hope and Fear & Draw Steel's Recoveries and Victories persisting between battles is CaPW.

Its not just Wrestlemania. It the Road to Wrestlemania of Royal Rumble, Elimination Chamber, and all the shows in-between.

Its not just being the smug fancy clothes wearing heel champion. It's beating all his minions, mercenaries, and heaters in dramatic fights to build up the final fight.

CaT to me feels more about making every scene theatrical.

CaPW to me feels more about hitting the spots and appearance to call back to the past, deliver the expected present, and promote the future. And that's through a form of real or imagined metacurrency.

Yeah I'm gonna lump that into theatre too. Especially because the most inspirational type of genre--battle shonen-- for Combat as Theatre do both anyhow.

 

[GobHag]

And the most important element for them both is the character expression anyhow--Killing your dad ontop of the crubling castle you once lived not being called theatrical just because it has context outside of the fight is worthless categorisation.

 

[Minigiant]

Yeah I'm gonna lump that into theatre too. Especially because the most inspirational type of genre--battle shonen-- for Combat as Theatre do both anyhow.

Combat as Theater as described doesnt do that.

Thats my point.

There are many types of Theater.

But Combat as Theater seems like it is more focuses on the scene than act or arc.

 

[Minigiant]

And the most important element for them both is the character expression anyhow--Killing your dad ontop of the crubling castle you once lived not being called theatrical just because it has context outside of the fight is worthless categorisation.

Thats just the story.

In CaPW, the son has 2 more charges of Smite but no Heals in the fight with his dad because he just fought his uncle. Fight's gonna be short unless something else he set up extends it.

In CaT, the son has what would make the scene be more dramatic.

 

[GobHag]

Combat as Theater as described doesnt do that.

Thats my point.

There are many types of Theater.

But Combat as Theater seems like it is more focuses on the scene than act or arc.

Both are still theatre is my point, I should know because I do both--sometimes a fight is just meant to make the players feel good(shoot the monk, flamethrowers against the Fire resistance barbarian, etc, etc) sometimes they're fighting a big villain. Is 5e not sport just because it has per day attrition?

 

[GobHag]

Thats just the story.

In CaPW, the son has 2 more charges of Smite but no Heals in the fight with his dad because he just fought his uncle. Fight's gonna be short unless something else he set up extends it.

In CaT, the son has what would make the scene be more dramatic.

In CaT, the son 2 more charges of Smite but no Heals in the fight with his dad because he just fought his uncle. Fight's gonna be short unless something else he set up extends it because it's more dramatic.

 

[Minigiant]

In CaT, the son 2 more charges of Smite but no Heals in the fight with his dad because he just fought his uncle. Fight's gonna be short unless something else he set up extends it because it's more dramatic.

This is an expansion of the definition then.

Because at no point was mechanical escalation and deflation during and between combats emphasized by anyone but me and another person.

 

[Scott Christian]

I don’t think these three modes are mutually exclusive.

This.

And I am not saying this to just play devil's advocate, but I find "combat as theater" to be the same as "combat as war" and "combat as sport." Identical. To me there is no differentiation.