How Much Do You Care About Novelty?

I value novelty a lot in passive fiction (books, movies, music), but in an active game I don't think I need much of it.

Novelty is easier for the GM because you get to read the book. For players, while they claim to like novel ideas, often, they have a hard time visualizing and living in the setting.

I fell in love with Coriolis. The sci-fi setting was unique and beautifully illustrated. Sadly, the players had problems with the (faux)-religious aspects of the setting and the rules. They couldn't get past their atheist stance.

On the other hand, a setting like Predations (dino-punk-time-travel-sci-fi) for the Cypher System, was immediately understood and absorbed by the players.

Mh, in terms of genre and setting I don't expect too much from the games itself, at the end the vibe of the game is largerly dependent on the DM. Even a Forgotten Realms D&D adventure can have a completely different flavor of fantasy depending on the DM running it.

In general I prefer more traditional fantasy or even if its more innovative I think it should be rooted in them and subvert the tropes. Tropesubversion is not innovative for me, its the same trope just in a different color. So I like it, example is Eberron.

The super weird and fresh settings I love in theory, when reading the books - but when actually playing them I feel its way harder. Because the players have less of a "shared memory" of how this world is supposed to look and feel like. I loved reading "Into the Odd" but when running a game we kinda failed to establish a shared vision, a colloborative fiction and fantasy and were a left a bit aimless and free-floating in narrative space because none of the table could really grasp the setting. Was a good learning experience to me - tropes and genre conventions are quite useful after all.

Where I LOVE innovation and new stuff is gameplay and systems. When I buy a new TTRPG I NEED them to try out something new. I still have my old games, they don't run away, I can play the old game when I want to play the old game. I don't to buy the same game with the same mechanics over and over again. I very much desire new takes, new experiments, new approaches to gameplay and mechanics.

@doctorbadwolf called it the Tyranny of Novelty. That overwhelming need to
innovate at the cost of continuity and quality.

We’ve seen time and time again that new stories can be found in old material and existing tropes. Particularly when some tropes are leant into and subverted.

I’d love to see a good old 1-10 AP set in the Dalelands or Cormyr. It doesn’t need to be set on the elemental plane of sponge.

DragonLancer said:

I guess I prefer the tried and tested trope approach. I like things to be comfortable and familiar. It's easier for most people to get into.

Click to expand...

Yeah, including me. I feel a lot of "innovation" simply tries too hard to be different to suit my tastes.

So when it comes to settings and the fiction of the game in general, it is not necessarily exactly novelty I crave for, but it is some sort of clear identity beyond just collection of cliches, tradition and tropes. I want the setting to have its own distinct feel, instead of just being generic forgottenrealmesque mush.

For mechanics, I appreciate certain amount of streamlining, and more effective methods of doing things, but I have no interest in reinventing the wheel or gimmicky structures that ultimately amount to very little.

Crimson Longinus said:

So when it comes to settings and the fiction of the game in general, it is not necessarily exactly novelty I crave for, but it is some sort of clear identity beyond just collection of cliches, tradition and tropes. I want the setting to have its own distinct feel, instead of just being generic forgottenrealmesque mush.

Click to expand...

I like this definition of novelty. It fits something like Eberron or Earthdawn well. the tropes are there, but each setting still has its own identity.

Crimson Longinus said:

For mechanics, I appreciate certain amount of streamlining, and more effective methods of doing things, but I have no interest in reinventing the feel or gimmicky structures that ultimately amount to very little.

Click to expand...

I like systems attached to and integrated with existing systems. Dragonmarks, for example.

TheSword said:

It doesn’t need to be set on the elemental plane of sponge.

Click to expand...

I dunno- sounds absorbing!

Definitely novelty, innovation and weirdness for me. Genre doesn’t matter, although I prefer SF and GenericFantasyland gets old quick.

Reynard said:

RPGs usually exist in the same space as genre fiction, and genre fiction lives in this space between tried and true tropes, and innovative ideas.

So, when it comes to RPGs -- from your personal campaigns to published games/materials -- how much do you care about that relationship? Do you want comfortable tropes, or weird innovative ideas? Does the particular genre matter? Do you want that familiarity or innovation from publishers, or in your homebrew? Does the answer change if you are playing a campaign vs a one shot

Click to expand...

I’m with @Umbran in not seeing that strong tropes limits innovation, or vice versa. Numenéra, for example, has very strong tropes, but has a relatively innovative resolution system where “spending” core stats affects the action being taken. Plus a few other ones.

For me, there are systems I am happy with for most genres, so for a game to be worthwhile to me, it must be innovative. If it doesn’t do anything new, then I have no need of it. The only exception might be a very focused game where it cuts down to a few pages of rules that work perfectly for a game I want to play.

It’s why I don’t play 5E. It just doesn’t offer anything I cannot find in either 13th Age, PF2, D&D4E or FATE, all of which pre-date it. Basically anything new coming along has to compete with existing systems, and if it doesn’t find a niche that has yet to be explored, it dies. It’s not a bad RPG, it’s just unnecessary.

I have been trying out The One Ring, which has a number of innovative systems that fit Tolkien’s world better than the above set of games (and MERP, which I ran for 4 years). It adds value. I also tried Aliens from Free League, which had some innovations, but the system is pretty weak for campaign play and so I’m not likely to use it. But I tried it out because it was innovative.

[BTW, I’m using innovative in a broad sense; not limiting it to ‘never done before in any system’, instead more generally assuming it means ‘some thing or combination of things that make the game feel very different to others in the same space’]