MichaelSomething
Legend
Let's take the time to show our gratitude towards Gygaxian Naturalism! Let's talk about how great it is and stuff. I'm sure glad we have it for one.
OSR The Gygaxian Naturalism Appreciation Thread
- Thread starter MichaelSomething
- Start date
I always marveled at the details put into trolls.
For example, modern trolls just tell us this about regeneration:
"Regeneration. The troll regains 10 hit points at the start of its turn. If the troll takes acid or fire damage, this trait doesn't function at the start of the troll's next turn. The troll dies only if it starts its turn with 0 hit points and doesn't regenerate."
But original trolls give us all of this:
"Trolls regenerate at an amazing rate. Starting three rounds after first blood, the creatures recovers 3 hit points per round until healed. Trolls reduced to 0 or fewer hit points fall to the ground, incapacitated but not slain. Incapacitated trolls continue to regenerate and stand up to fight as soon as they have a positive number of hit points.
When using an edged weapon, it is possible to sever the thin limbs of a troll (a natural 20 with an edged weapon is needed). Severed limbs continue to fight after separation from the body (hands squeeze, heads bite if stepped on, etc.). Attacks by severed limbs are at normal chances to hit. Separated limbs fight for the remainder of the battle, then scuttle back and rebind with the body once the battle is over. Limbs unable to reach the body to die within 24 hours, but this is of little consequence since trolls regenerate lost body parts (including the head) within a week. If a troll is dismembered and scattered, the largest surviving piece regenerates. The others die within one day if they cannot rejoin that piece.
Only fire and acid cause permanent damage to trolls. These forms of attack destroy its regenerative ability. A troll reduced to 0 or fewer hit points and immersed in acid or burned with fire is killed."
If course, this section is all under the label "Combat", so it's harder to find. And more of a PITA to adjudicate. And there's also stuff about getting three potions worth of blood from a troll with no explanation of how troll blood regenerates. And it's not necessarily consistent with other crit rules. And it's hard to remember all the details. But it's there when you need it.
For example, modern trolls just tell us this about regeneration:
"Regeneration. The troll regains 10 hit points at the start of its turn. If the troll takes acid or fire damage, this trait doesn't function at the start of the troll's next turn. The troll dies only if it starts its turn with 0 hit points and doesn't regenerate."
But original trolls give us all of this:
"Trolls regenerate at an amazing rate. Starting three rounds after first blood, the creatures recovers 3 hit points per round until healed. Trolls reduced to 0 or fewer hit points fall to the ground, incapacitated but not slain. Incapacitated trolls continue to regenerate and stand up to fight as soon as they have a positive number of hit points.
When using an edged weapon, it is possible to sever the thin limbs of a troll (a natural 20 with an edged weapon is needed). Severed limbs continue to fight after separation from the body (hands squeeze, heads bite if stepped on, etc.). Attacks by severed limbs are at normal chances to hit. Separated limbs fight for the remainder of the battle, then scuttle back and rebind with the body once the battle is over. Limbs unable to reach the body to die within 24 hours, but this is of little consequence since trolls regenerate lost body parts (including the head) within a week. If a troll is dismembered and scattered, the largest surviving piece regenerates. The others die within one day if they cannot rejoin that piece.
Only fire and acid cause permanent damage to trolls. These forms of attack destroy its regenerative ability. A troll reduced to 0 or fewer hit points and immersed in acid or burned with fire is killed."
If course, this section is all under the label "Combat", so it's harder to find. And more of a PITA to adjudicate. And there's also stuff about getting three potions worth of blood from a troll with no explanation of how troll blood regenerates. And it's not necessarily consistent with other crit rules. And it's hard to remember all the details. But it's there when you need it.
the Jester
Legend
I'm a big fan of Gygaxian naturalism. Things like gelatinous cubes having evolved to live in dungeons are awesome.
I think that we can safely say that early DnD worlds are more fecund than ours and also have a much higher rate of mutation. Also, in 1e, I think just about anything can crossbreed- there are lots of weird examples, like (IIRC) brownies and sylphs.
I think that we can safely say that early DnD worlds are more fecund than ours and also have a much higher rate of mutation. Also, in 1e, I think just about anything can crossbreed- there are lots of weird examples, like (IIRC) brownies and sylphs.
AlexofBarbaria
Explorer
I love Gygaxian naturalism and wish it were more present in the OSR.
There aren't enough autodidact beardos getting out of their depth with cockamamie amateur science today.
I want more essays on realistic falling damage, realistic ecology, realistic economics, realistic poisons, realistic lockpicking, realistic armor/weapons, etc.
Geek culture has become mainstream, but nerd culture is still on the margins. I think there's both a capitalistic and culture war component to that. Nerdery produces little profitable IP and many left-leaning people seem to have a bit of an intrinsic allergy to it.
There aren't enough autodidact beardos getting out of their depth with cockamamie amateur science today.
I want more essays on realistic falling damage, realistic ecology, realistic economics, realistic poisons, realistic lockpicking, realistic armor/weapons, etc.
Geek culture has become mainstream, but nerd culture is still on the margins. I think there's both a capitalistic and culture war component to that. Nerdery produces little profitable IP and many left-leaning people seem to have a bit of an intrinsic allergy to it.
darjr
I crit!
Gygaxian Naturalism I like when random tables would work too. Basically the same thing anyway.
I do love when neat new ideas I never would have come up on my own get generated because of the above. Like the fungus is there because the Trolls grow it, but why, to bring in the cave crickets, which the necromancer needs for his new spells, etc.
I do love when neat new ideas I never would have come up on my own get generated because of the above. Like the fungus is there because the Trolls grow it, but why, to bring in the cave crickets, which the necromancer needs for his new spells, etc.
Micah Sweet
Level Up & OSR Enthusiast
I agree. Gygax's Simulationist sensibilities (compared to a lot of modern games, and no matter what he said when trying to sell his game) very much informed my own preferences, and still inspire me. The 1e DMG was the first RPG book I ever read cover to cover!
AlexofBarbaria
Explorer
I love the fact that an insurance salesman/shoe cobbler without a college degree wrote the 1e DMG. I picture Gygax coming home from the library with a stack of books on botany, gemology, evolutionary biology, polearms, ancient currencies, more polearms, etc. (in addition to his trusty thesaurus of course) and just having a grand old time nerding out.
Reynard
aka Ian Eller
The problem with Gygaxian Naturalism is that Gygax did not really understand naturalism. The concept broadly is fine, but we shouldn't expend too much effort in making it make sense. The best we can do is try and embrace fantasy verisimilitude to create challenges that make some sense.
darjr
I crit!
I think that's actually the point. It's not a "problem".
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