The same that happened Gygax happens to Rein-Hagen?

I was watching the WoD documentary and it got to a part where Mark Rein-Hagen goes to Hollywood to get VtM tv stuff done and due to expenses there he goes home and finds the company in financial distress and he in ultimately kicked out by his partners (who are also brothers).

Like TSR what?

The dude who made a game that almost rivaled D&D and he went out the same way?

Yeah it’s not exactly the same situation but wow!

Those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

I heard he'd been living in Georgia (the country, not the US state) for a while now and not really involved with any US RPG publisher. I saw an article where he was lamenting the lack of a gaming scene there and working on something built around the local mythology, but I don't remember much detail. But I didn't know the circumstances of him leaving or how long it had been.

I work with Mark just about every week. Have for some time now. He is an amazing person and he has a tough life. He wants to get back to gaming, he wants to build on what went before - but he also wants to build something new as well.

What happened at WW years ago was more than just a deal and a cut out. These kids, cause they were sooo young! Were on a train of production, creation, development, and popularity that there were many pressures that sent things the way they did.

Mark is back in the US from Georgia, but he still has family back there and things are tough. I hope the game we made will get its chance to shine and go to publish, but things are different now then in the 90s. And he hasn't had the energy or time to build his name-brand over the years.

I can tell you what though, the man is a killer storyteller! Beyond just game developing with him, he runs amazing games - of anything. His creativity is off the charts for sure.

DarkCrisis said:

I was watching the WoD documentary

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Link/name/source?


And was Buck Roger’s somehow involved?

TerraDave said:

Link/name/source?


And was Buck Roger’s somehow involved?

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It’s on YouTube. Easy to find.

RenleyRenfield said:

What happened at WW years ago was more than just a deal and a cut out. These kids, cause they were sooo young! Were on a train of production, creation, development, and popularity that there were many pressures that sent things the way they did.

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At the time of the fallout Rein-Hagen was in his early 30s, can't call that a kid anymore nor young (it's over when you hit 30! ).

Many folks going into business, especially pnp RPG business, have no business being business owners. They can be great people, great creators, but they are most often horrible business people. And when people age, their focus changes, in this case it might have been the focus on the TV Series or it might just have been other things, people grow apart all the time. If it's the TV business, and it's not something the other two partners agreed with, it's not strange that there's a fallout when the rest of the partners focus on the business... I don't know the specifics, and this is pure speculation, but I've seen enough small business drama. It's also a reason why I would never start a business with someone else as a partner.

I always thought that the Exile sci-fi game he was working on had potential, it was interesting and it's always in the back of my mind as something that might be an interesting setting (the rules were a mess at the time), but just requires more work.

To me Rein-Hagen reminds me of a less successful Jordan Weisman (Fasa, Wizkids, HBS, etc.). Someone with very cool ideas, but no long term staying power with those ideas.

YourMom said:

Rein-Hagen is a low life alt right dirt bag. I'm happy life has been hard for him. Well deserved.

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First, welcome to the boards.

Second, you registered just to say this. I'm not a moderator, but this is not that kind of site that wishes people's kids get cancer and junk like that. Have something actual to say.

V:TM is responsible for a very specific style of urban fantasy, that many future creative endeavors from True Blood (Sookie Stackhouse), Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Twilight, etc etc have taken and run with. The premise being - all the monsters are real. That being the case, what if...? In the case of V:TM et al, the what if is "what if YOU were one of the monsters...?"

Anyway, I was never much into V:TM personally (my first session the GM was hella creepy and that was that - he later was arrested and did time); but 31 years later I'm still playing Vampire the Eternal Struggle CCG; and I love urban fantasy novels (Butcher, McGuire, Aaronovitch, Briggs, Harris (Charlaine)). I even really enjoyed the Twilight series up until the final chapter.

Of which to say - I would love to see something more from Mark R*H, and sorry to hear he's had some personal struggles.

I never met Mark R*H, but did met Steven Wieck at a couple GAMA trade shows, and he seemed a straight up guy (never met Stewart RIP), and sorry to hear that there was falling out/bad blood. Sorry, but in no way surprised. The hobby game industry is personal in a way that larger industries are not.