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<blockquote data-quote="ppaladin123" data-source="post: 6166373" data-attributes="member: 60923">Well imagine a level 20 wizard casting charm. He has 20 Int so +5 and a +3 class bonus for a save DC of 18.A fighter, unlike a ranger or a cleric, probably won't invest much in wisdom. So here is a comparison:Cleric with 20 Wis: +5 save bonus. Has to roll a 13 or higher to save against this charm spell. So she has a 45% chance of succeeding.Fighter with 12 wisdom: +1 bonus: needs to roll a 17 or higher on one out of two rolls. Chance of failure is (4/5 * 4/5=16/25 ) 64%. So that is only a 36% chance of success. That isn't great. So the fighter is generally only likely to kick butt on strength/con saves.But imagine a fighter that decides for some reason to max out wisdom. With a +5 bonus to the save he'd have to get 13 or higher on at least one of two rolls. That is (1- (12/20*12/20) = 64% probability. Now we are getting into a decent chance of success but it has come at great expense in forgone feats or less focus on other stats.(Aside: the lesson is to always be an elf since they are outright immune to charm and sleep, which are the two most dangerous conditions for the melee-tyoes).</blockquote>

[QUOTE="ppaladin123, post: 6166373, member: 60923"] Well imagine a level 20 wizard casting charm. He has 20 Int so +5 and a +3 class bonus for a save DC of 18. A fighter, unlike a ranger or a cleric, probably won't invest much in wisdom. So here is a comparison: Cleric with 20 Wis: +5 save bonus. Has to roll a 13 or higher to save against this charm spell. So she has a 45% chance of succeeding. Fighter with 12 wisdom: +1 bonus: needs to roll a 17 or higher on one out of two rolls. Chance of failure is (4/5 * 4/5=16/25 ) 64%. So that is only a 36% chance of success. That isn't great. So the fighter is generally only likely to kick butt on strength/con saves. But imagine a fighter that decides for some reason to max out wisdom. With a +5 bonus to the save he'd have to get 13 or higher on at least one of two rolls. That is (1- (12/20*12/20) = 64% probability. Now we are getting into a decent chance of success but it has come at great expense in forgone feats or less focus on other stats. (Aside: the lesson is to always be an elf since they are outright immune to charm and sleep, which are the two most dangerous conditions for the melee-tyoes). [/QUOTE]

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