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<blockquote data-quote="Skyscraper" data-source="post: 6255986" data-attributes="member: 48518"><p>Wow, nice reviews, thanks to everyone for taking the time to write. Many of the points that are raised in this thread are really relevant to me; the story-driven character creation probably at the front of these.</p><p></p><p>Specific questions in no particular order, if I may:</p><p></p><p>1) <u>Realistic time for one combat = ?</u>.</p><p></p><p>Background: I played 4E and some people posted that combat was allegedly quick if you knew what you were doing. That is an outrageous lie <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> Well, maybe for them it went well, but really, 4E combat was very long for most groups. Our group of experienced players NEVER got any combat done in less than 1.5 hours; and it usually took about 2.5 to 3 hours per combat. Sometimes 4 hours, for particular big battles. Sure, we're a laid-back group that role-plays during battle, but still, I never got how some groups managed to end all their 4E battles within 1 hour, according to their posts.</p><p></p><p>Now, we'll remain the laid-back group that we are, and I'm most certainly not going to use a chess timer at my table. We're just out of a DCC campaign where combat never took more than 30 minutes, often only 10 or 15...</p><p></p><p>So, what of 13A? Do people say that it doesn't take long because they like the game? Because nobody talks during combat and they use a chess timer to quickly end any player's turn? Or because it's really quick? At least one poster here says that it's 2 hours per combat. To me, that's way too long. I like interesting battles, but in a 4-5 hour session, I can't systematically have half of the session spent on a single battle. Consider us slow players in getting battles done, if 4E is any indication. 2 hours + for each combat is a deal-breaker for me, so please be frank and not optimistic <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></p><p></p><p>2) <u>Monster and NPC creation time = ?</u>. I'm thinking about possibly using 13A to DM. As always, I'm going to create my campaign. 4E had GREAT monster creation rules. But it takes 30 minutes to get a flavorful and balanced monster created from the ground up. Again, can't have that.</p><p></p><p>3) I've read a review of the core book. It says there is <u>no art for the monsters. True? </u>If so, bummer. (No deal-breaker or course.)</p><p></p><p>4) <u>What is 13 True Ways about? </u>Why is this supplement eagerly awaited? How many books do I need to buy to run a campaign in this setting? How many am I likely to want to buy once I buy the core rulebook?</p><p></p><p>5) <u>Spells: what do they look like?</u> 4E did away with spells (in my humble opinion). Are they back to 3.5-ish? I'm not sure I understand the above posts about spells. Do you have examples of known spells and how they work, so I may understand a bit better?</p><p></p><p>6) <u>Classes: fun options for all?</u> DCC spoiled us with really nice options for all classes, be that the fun warrior Mighty Deeds of Arms, the luck use by thieves, the incrementally powerful spellcasting results for clerics and wizards, spellburn, disapproval, ... Each class really gets a specific mechanic that is fun to use and opens up some interesting in-game moments. If I compare to D&D 3.5: a lot of stuff in 3.5 was passive bonuses or other elements that didn't open up in-game opportunities for players. Your fighter is a fighter because he gets greater bonuses to hit (passive stat), he's allowed to wear better armor that, in turn, provides a better AC value (passive stat), he has more HPs (passive stat) and he can wield a weapon that deals more damage (passive stat). That's why he's a fighter. What of 13 A?</p><p></p><p>Thanks again for your time and information,</p><p></p><p>Sky</p><p></p><p>p.s.: I like 4E for what it is, by the way, and I've played a lot of it, during a couple of years. I'm not bashing it, I'm using what I feel are it's weak points to try to understand 13 A.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Skyscraper, post: 6255986, member: 48518"] Wow, nice reviews, thanks to everyone for taking the time to write. Many of the points that are raised in this thread are really relevant to me; the story-driven character creation probably at the front of these. Specific questions in no particular order, if I may: 1) [U]Realistic time for one combat = ?[/U]. Background: I played 4E and some people posted that combat was allegedly quick if you knew what you were doing. That is an outrageous lie ;) Well, maybe for them it went well, but really, 4E combat was very long for most groups. Our group of experienced players NEVER got any combat done in less than 1.5 hours; and it usually took about 2.5 to 3 hours per combat. Sometimes 4 hours, for particular big battles. Sure, we're a laid-back group that role-plays during battle, but still, I never got how some groups managed to end all their 4E battles within 1 hour, according to their posts. Now, we'll remain the laid-back group that we are, and I'm most certainly not going to use a chess timer at my table. We're just out of a DCC campaign where combat never took more than 30 minutes, often only 10 or 15... So, what of 13A? Do people say that it doesn't take long because they like the game? Because nobody talks during combat and they use a chess timer to quickly end any player's turn? Or because it's really quick? At least one poster here says that it's 2 hours per combat. To me, that's way too long. I like interesting battles, but in a 4-5 hour session, I can't systematically have half of the session spent on a single battle. Consider us slow players in getting battles done, if 4E is any indication. 2 hours + for each combat is a deal-breaker for me, so please be frank and not optimistic :) 2) [U]Monster and NPC creation time = ?[/U]. I'm thinking about possibly using 13A to DM. As always, I'm going to create my campaign. 4E had GREAT monster creation rules. But it takes 30 minutes to get a flavorful and balanced monster created from the ground up. Again, can't have that. 3) I've read a review of the core book. It says there is [U]no art for the monsters. True? [/U]If so, bummer. (No deal-breaker or course.) 4) [U]What is 13 True Ways about? [/U]Why is this supplement eagerly awaited? How many books do I need to buy to run a campaign in this setting? How many am I likely to want to buy once I buy the core rulebook? 5) [U]Spells: what do they look like?[/U] 4E did away with spells (in my humble opinion). Are they back to 3.5-ish? I'm not sure I understand the above posts about spells. Do you have examples of known spells and how they work, so I may understand a bit better? 6) [U]Classes: fun options for all?[/U] DCC spoiled us with really nice options for all classes, be that the fun warrior Mighty Deeds of Arms, the luck use by thieves, the incrementally powerful spellcasting results for clerics and wizards, spellburn, disapproval, ... Each class really gets a specific mechanic that is fun to use and opens up some interesting in-game moments. If I compare to D&D 3.5: a lot of stuff in 3.5 was passive bonuses or other elements that didn't open up in-game opportunities for players. Your fighter is a fighter because he gets greater bonuses to hit (passive stat), he's allowed to wear better armor that, in turn, provides a better AC value (passive stat), he has more HPs (passive stat) and he can wield a weapon that deals more damage (passive stat). That's why he's a fighter. What of 13 A? Thanks again for your time and information, Sky p.s.: I like 4E for what it is, by the way, and I've played a lot of it, during a couple of years. I'm not bashing it, I'm using what I feel are it's weak points to try to understand 13 A. [/QUOTE]
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